Some benefits of being an emergency doc are that I don't work that many hours and I have an extremely flexible schedule. This not only allows me time to build a side business called The White Coat Investor, LLC, but it also allows me to go on a lot of trips. I took a lot of fun trips this summer, including Alaska, Zion National Park, Lake Powell, and climbing trips to The Wind Rivers and the Shawangunks. In October, I decided to attend a couple of conferences instead of a “fun trip.” The first of these was Bogleheads 12 in Valley Forge, Pennsylvania, home of Jack Bogle and home of Vanguard.
The Bogleheads forum is hands down the best investing forum on the internet. It is extremely active (500-1000 posts per day), heavily moderated (which I've learned to appreciate now that I have to moderate the comments on my own website), and filled with not only helpful people, but also very intelligent people. Like good doctors, Bogleheads try to base their investing on the best evidence they can find and avoid emotional and behavioral errors. I've been participating there since I was a resident, long before the forum migrated from Morningstar's Vanguard Diehards forum to its own site and at one time was one of the top ten most frequent posters, although I've slipped to fifteenth since I started putting most of my online effort at giving people a “fair shake” on Wall Street into this blog.
Bogleheads 12
Each year 200 of the Bogleheads get together for a 2 day reunion and conference. Many people I tell about this (including many Bogleheads), think this is pretty bizarre. One recent comment about it from a non-attendee read like this:
[What is this] a bunch of middle aged white dudes with “Captain Picard” like hair style getting really excited to go to financial motivation speeches with break out classes covering back door Roth IRAs?
To which the only reasonable answer is, “Yes, it's a total nerd-fest.” At 38, I was definitely one of the 5 or 10 youngest people at the conference. The majority of attendees were males from 50-70. At least half were retired. There were many business owners, engineers, doctors, techies, authors, financial advisors, and even a diplomat. The conference ran from Wednesday at 6 pm to Friday at 1 pm.
People attended for all kinds of different reasons. Some were asked to come speak or be part of a panel. Others were there primarily to learn more about investing. Still others wanted to connect with people they've “known” online for years. Some came just to meet Boglehead “celebrities” like Jack Bogle, Gus Sauter, Rick Ferri, Bill Bernstein, and others whose writings had heavily influenced their investing decisions and most likely, made them a lot of money. Most attendees thought it was pretty cool to go over to the Vanguard campus to visit their money and hear from those who are managing it. I suppose it is a bit like the annual Berkshire Hathaway meeting. Certainly the same advice is given out- buy good businesses, hold on to them forever, keep your costs down, invest in index funds etc. But is it nerdy? Of course it is.
Investing is nerdy. Buying, holding, and rebalancing a fixed asset allocation of index funds and worrying about your savings rate is not only boring, but intensely nerdy. Debating the proper duration and amount of TIPS in your portfolio would bore the vast majority of people I know to death. I have no idea why I find it interesting, but I do. I also like watching The Walking Dead, following the Vuelta a Espana and dinking around building a website, activities most people also consider kind of nerdy.
Get Rich Slowly
I can tell you what isn't nerdy, however, and there was a lot of it at Bogleheads 12. Being a millionaire isn't nerdy. Early retirement isn't nerdy. Never having to worry about whether you can afford something you want isn't nerdy. Not having to fork out $30K a year to an investment advisor isn't nerdy. Helping others become financially successful isn't nerdy. I think it's all pretty cool. I didn't know very many millionaires growing up, and still don't in real life, despite working with lots of doctors and other professionals. But millionaires are a dime a dozen when you're hanging out with the Bogleheads.
A poll from 2011 showed that half the Bogleheads are millionaires and 90% of them have more than 100,000. Given market returns the last couple of years, I wouldn't be surprised to see the percentages are even higher now. How do you learn to be a doctor? You hang out with doctors and do what they do. How do you learn to be a millionaire? You hang out with millionaires and do what they do. So what do Bogleheads do? They educate themselves, boost their income whenever possible, carve out a decent percentage of that income to build wealth, follow a reasonable, low-cost investing strategy and surprise, surprise, after 2 or 3 decades they're rich. Who knew it was so easy?
I saw some recent blog posts where millionaires were interviewed. The blog commenters were all really excited and wanting to ask additional questions about the featured millionaires. I could have written the posts myself without ever having read them because the story is always the same, and it's the same story countless Bogleheads could tell you over and over again. Get a good job, save a decent percentage, get a decent return on the savings, rinse and repeat.
You certainly don't have to go to a Bogleheads reunion in order to be a Boglehead or learn everything you need to know to be a successful investor. Reading a few good investing books and/or hanging out on their forum for a while is more than enough. But if you'd like to meet Jack Bogle before that transplanted heart of his gives out, visit Vanguard, and learn a little about investing, consider signing up for Bogleheads 13 next year. Even if you get appendicitis while you're there, you'll still likely make most of the events. Watch the forum for the announcement because it sells out fast. Don't be like one of my colleagues who I told about the trip. Instead of saying, “That sounds nerdy” she said, “I wish I had learned about that stuff when I was your age. I wouldn't have to still be working.”
FinCon 13
The other nerdy conference I attended in October was FinCon 13. I went from being one of the youngest and poorest at the Bogleheads meeting to being one of the oldest and richest at FinCon. This is essentially a financial bloggers conference. Some people go there to learn about finance and investing, but most people are there to network with other people and learn more about making money online. Unlike medicine, where once you get through the long pipeline you're essentially assured of a decent income, making money online is like the Wild West. It is very much a pyramid, where the top does very, very well (such as Pat Flynn who blogs about blogging to the tune of about $70K….a month) and the vast majority make little to nothing. It can very attractive for someone with an entrepreneurial spirit (especially if, like me, they don't have to risk their family's lifestyle on a dream thanks to a great regular job.) One of the highlights was enjoying a $100+ dinner with Mr. Money Mustache. You won't be surprised to learn that neither of us paid for it. (Thanks Lending Club– I'll be counting that dinner as part of my investment return!)
It turns out it is very easy to make a little bit of money online, but very difficult to make a lot. It's not unusual at all for a blogger to not make any money at all their first year. It's pretty tough to blog for a living like that. The barriers to entry might be low, but the long ramping up process weeds out most would-be professional bloggers in the first year or two. At any rate, I learned a lot at the conference that will hopefully improve your experience on the website, and improve the return I see from my time on it. If you're a blogger or have interest in developing any kind of internet-based business, I suggest you take some time to attend FinCon14.
What do you think? Have you attended a Bogleheads meeting? Was it a NerdFest or a Gathering of Millionaires? Comment below!
Who do you post as on Bogleheads?
EmergDoc
Is Bogleheads 13 also going to be in Valley Forge, PA? Or do they go to different cities each time?
It used to go to different cities every year, but it’s going to stay in Valley Forge for the remainder of Jack’s life so it is easier for him to go.
I read your blog and follow your precepts religiously. I too, hope to be in the ranks in a few years.
However, do you feel that for a person to start saving and investing, he/she needs to earn above a certain threshold, and be employed continuously for a long period. Do you think a person making lower than average wage or a person whose employment is uncertain will be able to save in a disciplined manner to become a millionaire or 1/2 millionaire.
The lower the wage and the more uncertain the employment the harder to get to a certain level of net worth such as $1 Million. But take someone making $50K who saves 20% of it and invests it at 8% a year. After 40 years he’d have $2.8M. So yea, it’s possible, but it’s definitely harder. However, I find people who are focused on becoming wealthy tend to not only be disciplined enough to save and invest well, but also disciplined enough to boost their income through promotions, a second job, a more successful business etc.
Absolutely correct about getting rich slowly. I have accumulated much wealth by the advice of one of my senior partners who is now retired.
He told me take any extra money and invest it in a low cost mutual fund tracking the S and P 500. He said he personally had owned apt houses, condo’s office buildings, K1’s and in the end most were money losers and a big headache.
Following his advice, I have now accumulated more money than I ever thought possible. Interestingly I watch my younger partners now buying up apt houses, condo’s, ethanol partnerships etc. All trying to “make a quick buck.” Over the years, this course to wealth has not been successful by watching the results of others whom traveled down that path.
Great article. It’s got me wanting to watch for the B-13 next year.
fd
Go for it. It’s a lot of fun for someone that’s into this stuff. The food is pretty good too! I was just disappointed that I didn’t get over to see the Valley Forge National Park. It was open the last day I was there, but I just didn’t have time.
Great post. I’m 38, also a doctor, but unlke you, knew nothing about money and investing until 2 years ago when I got so frustrated of earning decent income yet still living paycheck to paycheck with absolutely no savings. Finished residency 3 years ago, now contributing to 401K and Roth IRA since 2011. As erly as last year, my net worth was in the negative. Have personally educated myself, read tons of investing books, got out of debt last month (finally!) and have a better plan now to build wealth. Even though I may have missed the boat (on compounding), I’m more energized to work harder, live well below my means and increase my savings rate. It helps that my wife of 2 years is also on board and is a resident with future good income. Been a boglehead since July, 2013 and I do see your posts there quite often. I feel inspired by your posts and for starting this website, b/c sadly, many doctors (many of my colleagues at least) know nothing about investing and personal finance and many are still wallowing in debt and bad financial behavior.
So keep up the good work. I appreciate you.
Thanks for the kind words.
I can’t find the dates easily for the next Bogleheads meeting- Can you post the date? There are several meetings I already attend every October, so I would love to plan it ahead of time!
Thanks for this post- really helpful!
And BTW- The only way this meeting would be cooler would be if Captain Picard attended!
It conflicts with 2 conferences for me as well, not to mention it’s a month I’d much rather be home in Utah. The dates are set already since the hotel needed a lot of notice. I don’t know what the exact dates are, but if I had to guess, it would be 15-17th of October 2014.
http://www.bogleheads.org/wiki/Bogleheads%C2%AE_convention_meetings
You could PM Mel Lindauer on the Bogleheads board to confirm those dates if you needed to.
Hi Doc-
Just found your blog! Let me give you a bit of background. I’m 62 (as of Thanksgiving) retired, a former RR guy, then Federal worker. Started saving in 1987 (at 36) through the Fed’s Thrift Savings Program. They use low cost index funds. That led me to Vanguard where the wife & I have our ROTH savings. Hardly HIGH earners, we are merely average.
Today, debt free, with over 700K in savings. Not bad for a couple of high school boobs.
I have read Bogle’s books and really believe the Index funds make the most sense. Why do anything else? We all start small. We all need to keep at it (saving) over the long haul. Markets go up, they go down. That’s where having assets diversified makes the road a bit less bumpy. Emotions can, and have ruined many investing plans over the years.
It has sure worked very well for this average family in WI. I retired at 60 because I could afford to, my wife will retire at years end. Keep up the good work, and continue to get rich slowly. It’s never how much you earn, only how much you get to keep. Maybe I’ll see you at a Bogleheads conference someday. Pay it forward.
Thanks for your kind words and congratulations on your early retirement.
Jim: It was a great treat to meat you @ Bogleheads this year, and thrilling to get a picture with Mr. Bogle. I often refer residents and fellows to Whitecoat investor; hopefully they will learn early in their careers the importance of low cost passive investing. Funny story: when I returned from the meeting, a partner of mine made a comment in passing regarding Vanguard. I whipped out my phone to show him my picture with Jack, and he immediately revealed that he too had been a Bogelhead for many years. Told him that he needed to carve time in his schedule next year to come to the meeting and I think he is considering doing so. Stay well, and thanks for all of your good work!
I would be curious to know if your LLC paid for these trips or if you deducted them some how from your income?
Of course. 100% deductible.
Do you know when and where FinCon2014 will place??
No, I don’t think it has yet been scheduled. But you can sign up for the email list here: http://finconexpo.com/ and you’ll get an email telling you about it.