By Dr. Jim Dahle, WCI Founder
Setting up a Backdoor Roth IRA can be confusing, so I thought I’d put together a tutorial on the steps people can refer to when they go through this process. Let's get started.
Table of Contents
- What Is a Backdoor Roth IRA?
- Who Should Do a Backdoor Roth IRA?
- When to Do a Backdoor Roth IRA?
- Backdoor Roth IRA Pros and Cons
- Backdoor Roth IRA Tax Implications
- Backdoor Roth IRA Steps
- How to Fix and Prevent Backdoor Roth IRA Mistakes
- Backdoor Roth IRA FAQs
What Is a Backdoor Roth IRA?
Despite its name, a Backdoor Roth IRA is not an account; it is a process with two steps:
- Contribute to a Traditional IRA.
- Complete a Roth conversion.
If you understand the rules of both of these steps, putting them together is no problem.
Who Should Do a Backdoor Roth IRA
Remember that if you are a low earner you can just contribute DIRECTLY to a Roth IRA and skip this Backdoor Roth IRA process.
Roth IRA Limits and Conversion Rules
Low earner is defined as a Modified Adjusted Gross Income (MAGI) under a phaseout range in 2024 of $146,000-$161,000 ($230,000-$240,000 Married Filing Jointly). Some docs—like residents, employee dentists, part-timers, and even some medical attendings in the lower-paying specialties who are married to a non-earner—can just contribute to a Roth IRA directly.
Anyone who earns at least $7,000 ($8,000 if 50+) can contribute $7,000 ($8,000 if 50+) to an IRA [2024]. If your income is below a MAGI of $146,000-$161,000 ($230,000-$240,000 Married Filing Jointly), you can contribute directly to a Roth IRA. If you have a retirement plan offered to you at work and your MAGI is below $77,000-$87,000 ($123,000-$143,000 Married Filing Jointly), you can deduct your traditional IRA contributions. Since most readers of this blog have a retirement plan through their job and have (or soon will have) a MAGI over $240,000, they will find that they can't make direct Roth IRA contributions or deduct their traditional IRA contributions. Thus, their best IRA option is the Backdoor Roth IRA process, i.e., an indirect Roth IRA contribution.
Spousal IRAs
Married physicians should be using a personal and a spousal Roth IRA, and you will usually need to fund both indirectly (i.e., through the Backdoor). This provides an additional $7,000 each ($8,000 for each spouse that is 50+) of tax-protected and (in most states) asset-protected space per tax year, and it allows for more tax diversification in retirement. Tax diversification allows you to determine your own tax rate as a retiree by deciding how much to take from tax-deferred (traditional) accounts and how much from tax-free (Roth) accounts. Remember that IRA stands for INDIVIDUAL Retirement Arrangement, so even if the pro-rata rule (discussed below) keeps you from doing the Backdoor Roth IRA, it doesn't necessarily keep your spouse from doing so. Each spouse reports their Backdoor Roth IRA on their own separate 8606, so the tax return for a married couple doing Backdoor Roth IRAs should always include two Form 8606s.
Married Filing Separately
The contribution and deduction income limits are particularly low if you are filing your taxes Married Filing Separately (MFS). Both the ability to contribute directly to a Roth IRA and the ability to deduct a traditional IRA contribution if you (or your spouse) are eligible for a retirement plan at work phase out between $0 and $10,000. Basically, the best option for anyone filing their taxes MFS is the Backdoor Roth IRA process, i.e., an indirect Roth IRA contribution.
There is an exception to these rules if you do not actually live with your spouse. In that case, your ability to contribute directly to a Roth IRA phases out between a MAGI of $146,000-$161,000 in 2024. If you live separately and are not covered by a retirement plan at work, you can deduct a traditional IRA contribution no matter your income. You can still do a Backdoor Roth IRA process in these situations where your IRA contribution is either partially or completely deductible. The tax bill will be precisely the same: $0 when done properly. However, instead of having no tax cost for either the contribution or the conversion, your deduction on the contribution will precisely equal the tax cost on the conversion, resulting in that same $0 tax bill for the entire process.
Mega Backdoor Roth IRA
A Mega Backdoor Roth IRA is completely different from a regular Backdoor Roth IRA. Despite its name, you actually do a Mega Backdoor Roth IRA with a 401(k), not an IRA. It requires a 401(k) that accepts both after-tax (not Roth) employee contributions and allows for either in-service withdrawals (and thus conversions to a Roth IRA) or, more commonly, in-plan conversions. Using the Mega Backdoor Roth IRA process, one could put as much as $69,000 ($76,500 if 50+) [2024] per year into a Roth 401(k) (or possibly a Roth IRA in addition to your usual $7,000-$8.000 contribution). However, this process has nothing to do with the Backdoor Roth IRA process we are discussing in this post.
When to Do a Backdoor Roth IRA
Lots of people wonder about the timing of a Backdoor Roth IRA.
IRA Contribution Deadline
There is really only one deadline to meet with the Backdoor Roth IRA process. IRA contributions for a given tax year must take place between January 1 of the tax year and April 15 (even if you file an extension) of the following year.
Backdoor Roth IRA Conversion Deadline
The conversion step may take place at any time. It can take place the next day or even the same day as the contribution. I don't recommend it, but you can wait months, years, or even decades between the contribution and the conversion step. There is no deadline for Roth conversions. If you need to perform a rollover or a conversion of a traditional, rollover, SEP, or SIMPLE IRA in order to avoid the pro-rata rule, you have until December 31 of the year you do the conversion step.
When Should You Contribute and Convert?
You should do both steps as soon as possible. Many white coat investors do the IRA contribution step and the Roth conversion step the first week of January each year. This maximizes the amount of tax-free compounding that can occur on those dollars. Minimizing the time between contribution and conversion and doing both steps within the calendar year is not required, but it certainly simplifies the paperwork.
Want to really make your paperwork complicated? Contribute to your IRA each month and convert it each month. Then, you have 12 contributions and 12 conversions to keep track of each year. Seriously, though, if you make enough money that you have to contribute to your Roth IRA(s) through the Backdoor Roth IRA process, you make enough to do it at one time each year.
Can I Do a Backdoor Roth IRA Every Year?
Yes. My wife and I have done one every year since 2010 and do not plan to stop until we no longer have any earned income. It is just one of the investment chores we perform once a year.
5-Year Rule
One factor that may push you to do a Backdoor Roth IRA earlier is the five-year rule. Now, there are at least three five-year rules related to IRAs, but the main one to pay attention to here is the five-year rule after a Roth conversion. This rule determines whether the withdrawal of principal from the account prior to age 59 1/2 will be penalty-free. The five-year period starts on January 1 of the year you do the conversion, so it could be a little less than five years. Roth IRA principal generally comes out tax- and penalty-free (it is only the earnings that may be subject to penalties), but that is only the case after the five-year rule has been fulfilled.
In essence, if you do a conversion of a Roth IRA at age 51, you can then withdraw the principal tax- and penalty-free starting at age 56 rather than age 59 1/2. This can provide funding for living expenses to early retirees. If you do a Roth conversion at age 57, you still get access to that principal (and earnings) tax- and penalty-free at age 59 1/2. So, it's five years or age 59 1/2, whichever comes first.
There is also a completely separate five-year rule on IRA contributions, but this starts from the time you make your very first IRA contribution, not every contribution, so it should not apply to most early retirees.
Backdoor Roth IRA Pros and Cons
There are a lot of great things about the Backdoor Roth IRA, but it isn't all peaches and cream.
Pros of Backdoor Roth IRA
The main benefit of a Backdoor Roth IRA is that it provides you with another retirement account. Via the Backdoor Roth IRA process, you can continue to contribute to a Roth IRA even after your earnings rise above the income limit for direct Roth IRA contributions. Retirement accounts eliminate the tax drag that applies in a taxable, or non-qualified account, reducing your taxes and allowing your investment to grow at a higher rate so you can reach your goals sooner.
How much can that tax protection be worth compared to a taxable account? It depends on the return of the underlying investment, its tax efficiency, and the amount of time the money is left in the account. At my marginal tax rate, $10,000 earning 8% in a tax-inefficient investment over 50 years would grow to $469,000 in a Roth IRA but only $88,000 in a taxable account. More realistically, over 30 years, the use of a Roth IRA vs. a taxable account for a tax-efficient investment would still result in 29% more money.
Retirement accounts ensure simple estate planning. By using beneficiaries, that money does not go through the probate process, so your heirs get it sooner with less hassle, more privacy, and no cost. They can even stretch the tax-protected growth benefit for another decade after they inherit the account. Retirement accounts like a Roth IRA also provide substantial asset protection in most states, meaning that in the admittedly very rare event of a dramatically above-policy limits judgment that isn't reduced on appeal, you can declare bankruptcy and still keep what is in your retirement accounts. Roth money is tax-free forever, so by continuing to contribute each year, you can increase tax diversification in retirement.
Cons of Backdoor Roth IRA
Roth IRAs, even when you contribute via the Backdoor Roth IRA process, are still retirement accounts with all of their downsides. Retirement accounts limit the investments you can put in them and prohibit the use of margin investing. If you withdraw Roth IRA earnings prior to age 59 1/2 without an approved exception, you will owe a 10% penalty.
Due to the pro-rata rule (see below), the Backdoor Roth IRA process requires you to either convert or roll over into a 401(k) any traditional IRAs, SEP-IRAs, and SIMPLE IRAs you may have. If you have self-employment income, you will need to use a solo 401(k) instead of a SEP-IRA to shelter that income from taxes. Doing Backdoor Roth IRAs each year also adds one form (IRS Form 8606) per spouse to your tax return. If preparing your own taxes using tax software, it can be tricky to ensure the software reports the process correctly. If you do a Backdoor Roth IRA instead of (rather than in addition to) maxing out your tax-deferred accounts during your peak earnings years, that can also be a mistake that results in the accumulation of less money.
Perhaps most significantly, there are now two steps to getting money into your Roth IRA each year instead of just one. While I think the process is pretty darn simple, I am continually amazed at all of the unique ways that doctors manage to screw it up. Later in this article, I'll show you how to fix all of those screwups.
Is a Backdoor Roth IRA Worth It?
Yes! Most of the time. It really is just a little bit of hassle to do each year, although there may be some additional hassle the first year if you need to take care of another IRA first to avoid the pro-rata rule. There may be times when someone has a large traditional IRA they cannot afford to convert to a Roth IRA and cannot roll over into a 401(k) because they don't have a 401(k) at all, their 401(k) charges high fees, or because the IRA assets are invested in something they cannot invest in within a 401(k). If your employer-provided retirement account is a SIMPLE IRA or a SEP-IRA, the Backdoor Roth IRA process is also probably not worth it. Finally, some multi-millionaires don't want to bother with even the minor hassle of the Backdoor Roth IRA process because getting an extra $7,000-$16,000 a year into Roth accounts just isn't going to move the needle for them.
Backdoor Roth IRA Tax Implications
Roth IRAs are all about avoiding taxation on earnings, so naturally, there are lots of tax implications of this process.
Pro-Rata Rule
The most important tax implication to be aware of is the pro-rata rule. I would estimate that 90%+ of Backdoor Roth IRA screwups involve the investor having his or her conversion pro-rated. When you report a Roth IRA conversion on IRS Form 8606 (see below), there is a pro-rata calculation made. The numerator is the amount converted. The denominator is the total of ALL traditional, rollover, SEP, and SIMPLE IRAs, but not 401(k)s, 403(b)s, 457(b)s, Roth IRAs, or inherited IRAs. Therefore, it is critical that you DO SOMETHING with any IRA balance you have PRIOR to December 31 of the year in which you do a Roth conversion of after-tax money. Later in this article, I'll describe the exact options you have for what to do with this money.
Tax on Backdoor Roth IRA Conversion
Done properly, there is NO tax on a Backdoor Roth IRA conversion. Zero. Nada. Zilch. While the money you put into a Roth IRA (indirectly via the Backdoor in this case) was taxed when you earned it, it is NOT taxed when you contribute it directly to a Roth IRA or when you contribute it as a non-deductible IRA conversion or when you subsequently convert that money to a Roth IRA. In fact, it is never taxed again.
Do I Need to Worry About the Step Transaction Doctrine?
There used to be a concern that the IRS would have a problem with the Backdoor Roth due to an IRS rule called The Step Transaction Doctrine. This rule basically says that if the sum of a bunch of legal steps is illegal, then you can’t do it. Some wondered if this Backdoor conversion from a Traditional IRA to Roth was a legal transaction considering this doctrine. Those concerns, valid or not, are no longer an issue. The IRS clarified in early 2018 that no waiting period is required between the contribution and conversion steps of the Backdoor Roth IRA. It has essentially given its blessing on the whole process. Waiting just makes things more complicated on the 8606, as discussed in Pennies and the Backdoor Roth IRA.
How to Report a Backdoor Roth IRA on TurboTax
Reporting the Backdoor Roth IRA properly on TurboTax is unfortunately even more complicated than filling out Form 8606 by hand. The key to doing it right is to recognize that you report the conversion step in the Income section but you report the contribution step in the Deductions and Credits section. Since you generally do the income section first, you report the conversion before you report the contribution, even though you actually did the contribution before the conversion. At the end, you want to look at the Form(s) 8606 that TurboTax generates, just like you would check up on one filled out by an accountant.
More information here:
How to Report a Backdoor Roth IRA on TurboTax
Backdoor Roth IRA Steps, Tutorials, and Walkthroughs
In this section, we'll explain exactly how to do the Backdoor Roth IRA process and how to report it on your tax return, whether you file on paper or using tax software. You can easily walk through these Backdoor Roth IRA steps at Vanguard, complete a Backdoor Roth at Fidelity, or knock out a Backdoor Roth IRA at Schwab, three of the most popular brokerage/mutual fund companies.
How to Perform and Report on Paper the Backdoor Roth IRA Process
While it is really just a two-step process, it is best to think of it as a six-step process. These steps don't all have to be done in order (it might be easier to do Step 3 before Step 1), but they will all need to be done.
Step #1 Contribute to a Traditional IRA
Make a $7,000 ($8,000 if 50+) non-deductible traditional IRA contribution for yourself and one for your spouse. You can use the same traditional IRA accounts every year—they just spend most of the time with $0 in them. Most fund companies, including Vanguard, don’t close the account just because there is nothing in it. I do this every January 2.
Step #2 Leave the Money in Cash
An account like a traditional IRA is not an investment, of course; just like a suitcase isn't clothing. When putting money in a traditional IRA, you also have to tell the IRA provider how you want to invest. In this case, just leave the money in cash, whether a money market fund or a settlement fund. At Vanguard, the settlement fund is the Federal Money Market Fund. You really don't want to have any gains (or especially any losses) between the contribution and conversion step because it makes the paperwork more complicated. The best way to minimize the gains is to leave it in cash (and then of course to do the conversion as soon after contribution as possible to minimize the “pennies” issue).
Step #3 Convert the Traditional IRA to a Roth IRA
Next, convert the non-deductible traditional IRA to a Roth IRA by transferring the money from your traditional IRA into your Roth IRA at the same fund company. If you don’t already have a Roth IRA there, you’ll need to open one. This can be done in a minute or two online at Vanguard, and it is essentially the same process as opening the traditional IRA. I do this the very next day after I make the contribution. It is very straightforward. When you transfer the money, the website will throw up a scary banner saying something like “THIS IS A TAXABLE EVENT.” That’s true. It is taxable. But the tax bill will be zero since you’ve already paid taxes on the $7,000 and couldn’t claim your contribution as a deduction because you make too much money. You can do Step 3 basically immediately after Step 1. Some companies will let you do it the same day. Other companies will make you wait until the next day or even a week or so. But there is no reason to wait months to do it.
Step #4 Invest the Money
Now you will need to select an investment for the money in your Roth IRA. If you already have an investment in there, you can simply add $7,000 to it. Otherwise, you will need to select an investment in accordance with your written investing plan. If you do not have a written investing plan yet, you can leave the money in cash or put it into a Target Retirement 2050 fund or another lifecycle fund until you get that part of your financial plan worked out.
Step #5 Beware of the Pro-Rata Rule
Get rid of any SEP-IRA, SIMPLE IRA, traditional IRA, or rollover IRA money. The total sum of these accounts on December 31 of the year in which you do the conversion step (Step 2) must be zero to avoid a “pro-rata” calculation (see line 6 on Form 8606) that can eliminate most of the benefit of a Backdoor Roth IRA.
You can get rid of these IRA accounts in three ways:
- Withdraw the money (not recommended, as the money would be subject to tax and/or penalties, not to mention DECREASING your tax-advantaged/asset-protected investment space).
- Convert the entire sum to a Roth IRA. Only recommended if it is a relatively small amount and you can afford to pay the taxes out of current earnings or taxable investments with relatively high basis.
- Roll the money over into a 401(k), 403(b), or individual 401(k). 401(k)s don’t count in the aforementioned pro-rata calculation. Some physicians even open an individual 401(k) at Fidelity, eTrade, or Vanguard (rollovers from traditional IRAs to solo 401(k)s is a recent addition to Vanguard) in order to facilitate a Backdoor Roth IRA.
Step #6 Fill Out IRS Form 8606 Correctly
The next part of the Backdoor Roth IRA is done months later when you (or your accountant) fill out your IRS Form 8606 on your taxes. Don't forget to do it or there is a $50 penalty. Remember that you need one form for each spouse: INDIVIDUAL Retirement Arrangements. You need to double-check this to make sure it is done right, even if you hire a pro to avoid screwing up this part. Advisors have told me that they have had to help clients fix dozens of these that tax preparers have done improperly. If you don't do it right, you'll pay taxes twice on your Backdoor Roth IRA contribution.
Page 1 (below) shows a “distribution” from your non-deductible IRA. Since the money was already taxed, the taxable amount on your distribution is zero. Line 1 is your non-deductible contribution. On Line 2, your basis is zero because you had no money in a traditional IRA on December 31 of last year (if you've been carrying a non-deductible IRA for years, this may not be zero). Line 6 is zero in a typical year. Note that TurboTax may fill this out a little differently (may leave lines 6-12 blank), but you end up with the same thing. Line 13 is the same as line 3, so the tax due is zero.
Here's an example from the 2023 version of Form 8606.
On page 2 (below), you are showing the Roth conversion. I'm not really sure why you have to do this twice (since you're just transferring the amounts from lines 8 and 11 and then subtracting them), but that's what the form calls for. As you can see, a Roth conversion of a non-deductible traditional IRA contribution without any gains is a taxable event; it's just that the tax bill is zero for it.
When double-checking your tax preparer's work, you want to concentrate on lines 2, 14, 15c, and 18, and make sure they're a very small amount, like zero, and not a very large amount, like $7,000. The form can get more complicated if you are doing other Roth conversions at the same time or if you made a contribution for the previous year (i.e., made your 2022 contribution in 2023). See below for more details.
Notice how there is no place on the form to put the date when you made the contribution or the date when you made the conversion. It isn't on the form your IRA custodian sends to the IRS (1099-R) either.
Do It All Again Next Year
You do not have to wait any period of time between the contribution and conversion. Each year, I make my Traditional IRA contribution on January 2, then convert it to a Roth IRA the next day or within a few days. That gets my investment money working as soon as possible and simplifies the record keeping. Vanguard won’t let you do it the same day (sometimes other providers will), so I have to wait one day anyway. Occasionally they'll make you wait up to a week. If you find you have a few pennies left in the account and are worried you'll get pro-rated, take a look at this post: Pennies and the Backdoor Roth IRA.
More information here:
How to Do a Backdoor Roth IRA with Vanguard
How to Do a Backdoor Roth IRA at Fidelity
How to Fix and Prevent Backdoor Roth IRA Mistakes
In this section, we're going to talk about how to fix and prevent common mistakes in the Backdoor Roth IRA process. To better organize these mistakes, we will break down the process into the six very clear steps used above and then will explain possible errors with each step and what to do about them.
6 Steps to Successfully Contribute to a Backdoor Roth IRA
- Step 1 – Contribute to traditional IRA ($7,000, $8,000 if 50+ for 2024).
- Step 2 – Invest the money in a money market fund.
- Step 3 – Move money from a Traditional IRA to a Roth IRA (i.e., a Roth conversion).
- Step 4 – Invest in your preferred investment (typically a stock, bond, or balanced index mutual fund).
- Step 5 – Ensure you have no money in a traditional IRA, SEP-IRA, or SIMPLE IRA on December 31 of the year you do the CONVERSION step.
- Step 6 – Report the transactions correctly on your taxes by filling out Form 8606.
Seriously. That's it. If you can do a cholecystectomy, you can do this. If you can work up a pulmonary embolus appropriately, you can do this. If you can manage hypertension well, you can do this. If you can fill a cavity, you can do this. Super easy.
However, people still manage to screw up on EACH of those six steps. Let's go through the mistakes people make, step by step.
How to Fix Backdoor Roth IRA Mistakes
Step 1 Error – Contributing Directly to a Roth IRA
An error that commonly occurs with a first Backdoor Roth IRA is that people simply don't realize that their income is too high to make a direct Roth IRA contribution. Instead of doing it indirectly (i.e., going through the Backdoor), which is no big deal even if you're under the limit, they contribute directly to a Roth IRA. Then they realize their Modified Adjusted Gross Income (MAGI) is over $146,000-$161,000 ($230,000-$240,000 Married Filing Jointly) for 2024. Now what?
Enter the Recharacterization
If you have made this error, now you have to recharacterize the Roth IRA contribution to a traditional IRA contribution. This basically makes it as though you never contributed to a Roth IRA but contributed to a traditional IRA instead. You usually have to call your IRA provider to get this done, but it's no big deal. In this section, I'll walk you through the details of how to do it.
You have until the due date of your tax return to do this (including extensions). So, if you made an IRA contribution in January of 2023 for the 2023 tax year, you have until October 15, 2024, to do a recharacterization. There's no penalty or anything to do it. You can do the opposite as well if you contributed to a traditional IRA but meant to contribute directly to a Roth IRA.
Bear in mind that starting in 2018, you can no longer do recharacterizations of Roth CONVERSIONS (not contributions). This eliminated the “Roth IRA Conversion Horserace” technique for tax reduction.
Until only a couple of years ago, I had thought there was a waiting period after a recharacterization to then reconvert the money to a Roth IRA. However, that rule was only for recharacterizations of conversions, not contributions. There has never been a waiting period for a recharacterization.
Any gains that occur before the final conversion are, of course, fully taxable at your ordinary income tax rate in the year of the final conversion.
The Income Limit
The first thing to determine is whether this post even applies to you. If your income is below a certain amount, you can just contribute directly to a Roth IRA. That amount depends on several things. First, it is a MODIFIED Adjusted Gross Income (MAGI). That number is very similar to your Adjusted Gross Income (AGI). Remember how tax Form 1040 works.
The first income line you come to is line 7b, your “Total Income.” When people think about income, this is generally what they think of. The third income line on the form is line 11b. This is your “Taxable Income.” This is what your tax bill is actually calculated from. It is basically your total income minus all of your deductions. In between those two, on line 8b, is another income, your “Adjusted Gross Income.” This is “the line” that people are talking about when they use the phrases “above-the-line deduction” and “below-the-line deduction.” If it comes out before your AGI is calculated, it is an above-the-line deduction. These are deductions such as self-employment tax, self-employed retirement plans, self-employed health insurance premiums, HSA contributions, student loan interest, alimony, tuition, and any IRA deductions. If it comes out after your AGI is calculated, it is a below-the-line deduction. These are EITHER your standard deduction OR your itemized deductions, like mortgage interest, state/local/property taxes, and charitable contributions. A MAGI is just a slight tweak to your AGI.
Below are the MAGI limits for direct Roth IRA contributions [2024]. If your MAGI is below the first number, you can just contribute to a Roth IRA directly. If your MAGI is over the second number, you cannot contribute at all. If your MAGI is between the two numbers, you can make a partial direct contribution (most shouldn't bother with this, just do it all through the Backdoor).
- Married Filing Separately (and lived with spouse for at least part of the year): $0-$10,000
- Married Filing Jointly: $230,000-$240,000
- Single or Head of Household: $146,000-$161,000
If you think you'll be anywhere close to that first number, do yourself a favor and just make your Roth IRA contribution indirectly, i.e., through the Backdoor (contribute to a traditional IRA and then convert that contribution to a Roth IRA). Since 2010, there has been no income limit on Roth conversions and there has never been an income limit on traditional IRA contributions, just your ability to deduct them.
How does a MAGI differ from an AGI? It's a very slight difference. Bear in mind that there are other MAGIs out there. We're only talking about the one that affects Roth IRA contributions here. But to get your MAGI, you simply take your AGI, subtract some income from it, and add back in some other income to it. The worksheet showing you how to do this is Worksheet 2-1 in Publication 590.
Basically, you subtract income from a Roth conversion and you add income from IRA deductions (not sure why you'd have this), student loan interest (if you are using this worksheet, you probably don't have this), tuition deduction (you probably don't have this), a couple of rare deductions for foreign income/deductions (you probably don't have these), some savings bond interest you probably don't have much of, and some employer-provided adoption benefits. For most people, your MAGI = your AGI since all of these deductions are pretty rare for the folks worried about this limit for direct Roth IRA contributions. So, focus on your AGI. That means if you contributed directly to a Roth IRA but late in the year realized you probably should not have, one easy fix is to get your AGI below that limit by contributing to an HSA or a self-employed retirement plan like an individual 401(k) or SEP-IRA. Note that giving a bunch of money to charity is NOT a solution to this problem because that is a below-the-line deduction.
How to Do an IRA Recharacterization
If you can't get your MAGI low enough, you will have to do an IRA recharacterization. As far as the IRS is concerned, a recharacterization is as though you never made the Roth IRA contribution at all but made a traditional IRA contribution instead. You don't report a recharacterization separately; you just report a traditional IRA contribution. Keep in mind as you read on the internet about recharacterizations that there used to be two types of them—a recharacterization of a Roth IRA CONTRIBUTION and a recharacterization of a Roth IRA CONVERSION. The second type was outlawed in 2018, but the first one, the one we're talking about today, is still perfectly legal. If you decide you want to undo a Roth conversion these days, you're simply out of luck. Here is how you do a recharacterization of a Roth IRA contribution:
- You tell Vanguard (or wherever your IRAs are) to recharacterize the Roth IRA contribution to a Traditional IRA contribution.
Yup. That's it. The brokerage takes care of the rest. You can read all about all of the rules in Publication 590 Chapter 1 if you want, but that's basically what they say. Don't believe me? Fine. Here are the IRS instructions:
How Do You Recharacterize a Contribution?
To recharacterize a contribution, you must notify both the trustee of the first IRA (the one to which the contribution was actually made) and the trustee of the second IRA (the one to which the contribution is being moved) that you have elected to treat the contribution as having been made to the second IRA rather than the first. You must make the notifications by the date of the transfer. Only one notification is required if both IRAs are maintained by the same trustee. The notification(s) must include all of the following information:
- The type and amount of the contribution to the first IRA that is to be recharacterized.
- The date on which the contribution was made to the first IRA and the year for which it was made.
- A direction to the trustee of the first IRA to transfer in a trustee-to-trustee transfer the amount of the contribution and any net income (or loss) allocable to the contribution to the trustee of the second IRA.
- The name of the trustee of the first IRA and the name of the trustee of the second IRA.
- Any additional information needed to make the transfer.
In most cases, the net income you must transfer is determined by your IRA trustee or custodian.
See what I mean? It's just a phone call. Any earnings that the account had in between the contribution and the recharacterization just go over with the contribution. No big deal.
You have until your tax filing date to do this. Most of the time, that's April 15 of the next year. However, the IRS is even more lenient than that. You actually can do this for an extra six months after your tax filing date, but you will have to refile your return.
Where Do You Report a Recharacterization?
If you hire somebody else to prepare your taxes, you can skip this section. If you do it yourself, you'll need to make sure you report this correctly. According to Pub 590, you report it on our old friend Form 8606.
Pub 590 says this:
Actually, that's really misleading. If you read Form 8606, you will see that the only time it ever mentions a recharacterization is to tell you NOT to put it on the form.
So, what is Pub 590 talking about? They're talking about this section in the 8606 instructions:
Reporting recharacterizations.
Treat any recharacterized IRA contribution as though the amount of the contribution was originally contributed to the second IRA, not the first IRA. For the recharacterization, you must transfer the amount of the original contribution plus any related earnings or less any related loss. In most cases, your IRA trustee or custodian figures the amount of the related earnings you must transfer. If you need to figure the related earnings, see How Do You Recharacterize a Contribution? in chapter 1 of Pub. 590-A. Treat any earnings or loss that occurred in the first IRA as having occurred in the second IRA. You can’t deduct any loss that occurred while the funds were in the first IRA . . . Report the nondeductible traditional IRA portion of the recharacterized contribution, if any, on Form 8606, Part I. Don’t report the Roth IRA contribution (whether or not you recharacterized all or part of it) on Form 8606. Attach a statement to your return explaining the recharacterization. If the recharacterization occurred in 2023, include the amount transferred from the traditional IRA on 2023 Form 1040, 1040-SR, or 1040-NR, line 4a. If the recharacterization occurred in 2024, report the amount transferred only in the attached statement, and not on your 2023 or 2024 tax return.
The bottom line is that you just report this recharacterized contribution on Form 8606 as if it were the regular old non-deductible traditional IRA contribution that you should have made in the first place. You also need to include a statement. What should your statement look like? I would write something like this:
“To whom it may concern:
I made a 2024 Roth IRA contribution of $7,000 on March 13, 2024, because I didn't know about the whole MAGI limit thing when I made the contribution. After becoming smarter, I recharacterized $7,137.14 (original contribution plus earnings) to a traditional IRA on November 4, 2024. Thank you for helping our country fund its government. You're the best.
Hugs and kisses from your favorite taxpayer,
James Dahle”
Seriously, it doesn't say what has to be on the statement, just that there is one “explaining the recharacterization.” You don't even have to tell them why you did the recharacterization. If you had a loss in the account between contribution and recharacterization, no big deal. It's still as though you made a $7,000 contribution to a traditional IRA and THEN it lost money. If you were able to deduct the contribution (you probably can't) you would get a $7,000 deduction. The IRA provider may also send you a Form 5498 (which has the recharacterized amount on line 4), but you don't actually do anything with it when you file your taxes. It's just an informational return.
Reconverting the IRA
Here is where it gets interesting. You've now fixed your mistake in the eyes of the IRS, going from an illegal Roth IRA contribution to a legal traditional IRA contribution (that is probably not deductible for you). But you aren't done with what you meant to do, which is put money into a Roth IRA. You now need to do a Roth conversion. You do it just like you normally would as if you had contributed originally to the Traditional IRA. You can do it the very next day if you like. You can probably even do it the same day; just make sure there is a paper trail showing the money was actually in the traditional IRA at some point. There used to be a waiting period after a recharacterization before you could do a Roth conversion on that money. But that waiting period only ever applied to the recharacterization of a Roth CONVERSION (which was no longer allowed starting in 2018) and NOT the recharacterization of a Roth CONTRIBUTION. So, there is no waiting period. Just reconvert convert it and go on your merry way.
I hope this information helps you fix your mistake. Just do your Roth IRA contributions through the Backdoor going forward, and you won't have this problem again.
Step 2 Error – Not Investing in a Money Market Fund in the Traditional IRA
What happens if you LOSE money in between the contribution and conversion step? This problem is easily avoided by using an investment like a money market fund that does not go down in value for that time period. But some people fail to do so and end up losing money. When they work their way through their IRS Form 8606, they discover they have basis left over that they can then carry forward indefinitely for years! No big deal; it just makes your paperwork more complicated. Perhaps at some point in the future, you'll do a Roth conversion of tax-deferred money and this carry-forward basis will reduce the tax on that event.
What if you MADE money in the account between contribution and conversion? This actually happens most of the time, so I wrote an entire post on it called Pennies and the Backdoor Roth IRA. Technically, any money earned between the contribution and conversion step is fully taxable at ordinary income tax rates in the year of the conversion. If it is less than 50 cents, you just ignore it. If it's more, you report it on your 8606 and pay taxes on it.
If it is still in the traditional IRA, either do another tiny Roth conversion or leave it there until you do next year's Backdoor Roth IRA process. Either is fine. If you were smart and just used a money market fund and did the conversion as soon as your IRA provider allowed it (usually less than a week and sometimes as early as the next day), this won't be much money and there won't be much tax due.
Step 3 Error – Forgetting to Do the Conversion
If you forgot to do the conversion step for eight months afterward, it could be a huge gain on which you're unnecessarily paying taxes. No way to fix this one, just pay your “stupid tax” and move on.
Step 4 Error – Forgetting to Invest the Roth IRA Money
Even worse than paying taxes on a huge gain is not getting the gain in the first place because you left the money sitting in cash for months. No way to fix this one either. Your “stupid tax” this time comes in the form of opportunity cost. Just get the money invested ASAP to stop the cash drag. Maybe you even got lucky and the market went down in between contribution and investment so now you get to buy low.
Step 5 Error – The Pro-Rata Rule
Some of the most common questions I get are from people who make a late contribution to a Backdoor Roth IRA. What do I mean by late? You are allowed to make an IRA contribution AFTER the calendar year ends. In fact, you have until Tax Day, usually April 15 unless you get an extension of up to six months. While it is to your advantage to contribute to retirement accounts as quickly as possible so that money can start compounding in a tax-protected way, I understand that we all have lots of good things to do with our money and sometimes this gets pushed back into the next calendar year. All it really does is complicate your paperwork a bit.
For example: if you made your 2023 IRA contribution in April 2024, instead of reporting both the contribution and the conversion on your 2023 taxes, you would report only the contribution there. The conversion would be reported on the taxes for the year you did the conversion, i.e., your 2024 tax return due in April 2025. Your 2023 IRS Form 8606 becomes a little simpler and your 2024 IRS Form 8606 becomes a little more complicated. Not a big deal if you can follow the simple instructions.
What confuses people, however, is the pro-rata rule. This is the rule that says you need to empty your traditional IRA by December 31 of the year you do the conversion. Since these folks have never filled out a Form 8606 (or apparently read the instructions), they assume that for a 2023 contribution they need to have a balance of $0 at the end of 2023, even if they didn't do the conversion step until 2024. That's simply not the case. The pro-rata rule isn't applied until the year of the conversion, i.e., December 31, 2024.
Emptying the IRAs
How do you empty those IRAs? You usually have two choices.
- Do a Roth conversion of the whole thing. This is what I generally recommend for small IRAs where the tax bill on the conversion would not be too onerous. It is quick and easy, and it increases the amount of tax-free assets you have.
- Roll the money into a 401(k) or 403(b), either that of your current employer, that of a past employer, or to your own individual 401(k) if you are self-employed. This is usually a better option if you have a large IRA where you would rather deal with the hassle than pay the tax bill during your peak earnings years.
How large is large and how small is small? It's going to vary by the person and how much disposable cash they have. Most would consider an IRA under $10,000 to be small and an IRA over $100,000 to be large. In between, it's a personal decision as to which would be better for you.
What If You Didn't Empty the IRA?
What if you screwed this one up? Your Backdoor Roth IRA conversion step just got pro-rata'd. There is a tax bill associated with that because most of your conversion was of tax-deferred money rather than post-tax money like it was supposed to be.
The fix for this is going to vary by the individual, but the easiest fix is to simply convert the entire IRA to a Roth IRA now, so you end up getting all your post-tax money into that Roth IRA. Another possible fix is to figure out a way to separate your basis in that IRA, roll the tax-deferred money into a 401(k), and then convert the basis left behind in the IRA.
Do yourself a favor and just empty the darn IRA by December 31. Keep in mind that this is usually not an instantaneous process, so don't put it off until you're on holiday break at the end of the year.
Step 6 Error – Screwing Up the Tax Forms
Both individual taxpayers and professional tax preparers screw up IRS Form 8606 all the time. In fact, some of them haven't even heard of a Backdoor Roth IRA. (Incidentally, this is one of the best questions to ask while interviewing a potential tax professional—”How many Backdoor Roth IRAs did you help last year?”)
The usual fix to this error is to file a 1040X (Amended Tax Return) and a new Form 8606. You can do this for the last three years if necessary. If you didn't file Form 8606 at all, you'll definitely want to do this. The key is to check lines 15c and 18 on Form 8606. They should both be a number very close to zero if the form is being completed correctly.
The tax preparer should NOT be filing Form 5439. If you did Steps 1-5 right, this form probably doesn't belong in your tax return.
A lot of people wonder about the 1099-R sent to them by their IRA provider and worry that it was done wrong and that it will cause them to pay taxes they shouldn't have to pay. Sometimes the form was filled out wrong, but mostly this is just a lot of anxiety. What gets people anxious is finding something on Line 2a “Taxable amount.” As long as the box on Line 2b is also checked “Taxable amount not determined,” you're golden. Don't worry about it. If it is not, have the IRA provider send you a new, correct form—either with $0 in 2a or the box in 2b checked (usually the latter). Here's what mine from a few years back looked like from Vanguard:
Note that Box 2b is checked, even though a taxable amount of $5,500.07 is being reported to the IRS.
Again, if you're not sure how to enter this into TurboTax, check out my TurboTax tutorial.
Still Confused About the Backdoor Roth?
Need more help with a Backdoor Roth IRA? I wish Congress would just lift the rule against direct Roth IRA contributions for high earners and save us all this hassle, but who knows if that will ever happen.
- If you made your contribution after the end of the year, check out Late Contributions to the Backdoor Roth IRA.
- Here's a step-by-step tutorial for doing a Backdoor Roth IRA at Vanguard.
- Here's a step-by-step tutorial for doing a Backdoor Roth IRA at Fidelity.
- Here is a step-by-step tutorial reporting the Backdoor Roth IRA in TurboTax.
- Here is my prior post on 17 Ways to Screw Up Your Backdoor Roth IRA.
- You can hire a professional to help you—either a good financial advisor or a good tax strategist can assist.
- You can also ask your peers for help on the WCI Forum, the Private WCI Facebook Group, and the WCI Subreddit.
Late Contributions to the Backdoor Roth IRA
While it is “cleaner” to make your contribution and your conversion all in the same calendar tax year, you can make your contribution up until your tax filing date of the next year. The key to filling out the 8606 correctly when you make a contribution after the calendar year is to recognize that the contribution step is reported for the tax year and the conversion step is reported for the calendar year. So imagine you did the following during the calendar year 2023:
- Made a 2022 IRA contribution (reported on 2022 8606)
- Did a Roth conversion of that contribution (reported on 2023 8606)
- Made a 2023 IRA contribution (reported on 2023 8606)
- Did a Roth conversion of that contribution (reported on 2023 8606)
Your forms would look like this:
2022 Form 8606 (Only Have to Fill Out Part I)
Note that all this serves to do is report basis for the next year. No tax is due. Since no conversion step was done during the calendar year 2022, you only have to fill out lines 1-3 and 14.
2023 Form 8606 (Must Fill Out Parts I and II)
Note that you've got to do all of Part I plus Part II for this year because you did the conversion step, unlike last year (2022). Let's go through this line by line.
Form 8606 – Part I
- Line 1 – That's the money you contributed for 2023 (which would be $6,500).
- Line 2 – This is your basis. Since you made a contribution for 2022 but didn't do a conversion until 2023, your basis is $6,000.
- Line 3 – $6,500 + $6,000 = $12,500.
- Line 4 – Remember this is asking about 2024, not 2023, and since you won't make the mistake of doing your contribution late again, this will be zero.
- Line 5 – $12,500 – $0 = $12,500.
- Line 6 – This is the line that triggers the pro-rata issue. Even though you made a 2022 contribution, you did so AFTER December 31, so this line would still be zero if you filled it out for 2022, which you didn't because you didn't do a conversion in 2022 and got to skip lines 4-13. But this is the 2023 form and since you converted your entire traditional IRA, this will be $0.
- Line 7 – This doesn't include conversions. Since you didn't take any money out of your traditional IRA this year except the conversion, this is $0.
- Line 8 – You converted a total of $12,500 this year to a Roth IRA, so $12,500.
- Line 9 – $0 + $0 + $12,500 = $12,500.
- Line 10 – $12,500/$12,500 = 1.
- Line 11 – $12,500 * 1 = $12,500.
- Line 12 – $0 * 1 = $0.
- Line 13 – $12,500 + $0 = $12,500.
- Line 14 – $12,500 – $12,500 = $0.
- Line 15a – $0 – $0 = $0.
- Line 15b – You didn't take money out of an IRA to help you survive a disaster, so $0.
- Line 15c – $0 – $0 = $0.
Part II
- Line 16 – Line 8 is $12,500 so $12,500.
- Line 17 – Line 11 is $12,500 so $12,500.
- Line 18 – $12,500 – $12,500 = $0.
Backdoor Roth IRA FAQs
Can I still do a Backdoor Roth IRA for last year?
You have until tax day (generally April 15, but as late as October 15 if you file an extension) of the following year to make your traditional IRA contribution. There is no deadline for the Roth conversion step; it can be done at anytime. Make sure you fill out the paperwork properly according to the section above about late contributions.
Can I do last year's IRA contribution and this year's IRA contribution at the same time and convert them at the same time?
Yes. Just remember to report last year's contribution on last year's Form 8606 and this year's contribution and the conversion on this year's Form 8606.
Does my 401(k), 403(b), 457(b), Roth IRA, or inherited IRA count toward the pro-rata calculation?
No. Only traditional IRAs, rollover IRAs, SEP-IRAs, and SIMPLE IRAs count. See line 6 of Form 8606 for details.
What if it is a separate IRA? Does it still count?
Yes. All IRAs count toward the pro-rata calculation.
What should I do with my rollover or traditional IRA to avoid pro-ration?
If it is small, convert it to a Roth IRA along with this year's traditional IRA contribution and pay the tax due on it. If large, try to roll it into your employer's 401(k) or if you have self-employment income, into your individual 401(k).
I got pro-rated. What now?
The easiest solution is to convert the entire IRA, SEP-IRA, or SIMPLE IRA that caused the pro-ration and is now composed of both pre-tax and after-tax money. That is also the most expensive solution. A harder solution that may save you some taxes involves isolating the basis in that IRA by rolling the rest of the account into a 401(k) and then convert just the basis to a Roth IRA.
I am leaving my employer. Should I roll my 401(k) or 403(b) into a traditional IRA? If not, what should I do with it?
If you put it into a traditional IRA it is going to cause any future Backdoor Roths to be pro-rated. Better options include leaving it where it is; rolling it into your new employer's 401(k) or 403(b); rolling it into your individual 401(k); or, if it is small, just converting the whole thing to a Roth IRA.
How much can I contribute to a Roth IRA via the Backdoor Roth IRA process?
In 2024, you are allowed to contribute $7,000 ($8,000 if 50+) per year for you and $7,000 ($8,000 if 50+) for your spouse. This includes all contributions to traditional and Roth IRAs. Rollovers/transfers do not count toward the annual contribution limit.
What should I invest the money into?
While in the traditional IRA for a day or two, leave it in cash. Once it is in the Roth IRA, invest it according to your written investing plan. If you don't have one, get one, but in the meantime it would be a good idea to put it into a lifecycle fund such as a Vanguard Target Retirement Fund.
Can I use the same traditional and Roth IRA each year or do I need new ones?
You can use the same ones each year.
The Backdoor Roth IRA process leads to more tax-free retirement account money for doctors and other high-income professionals. If you follow the simple steps outlined above, you will pay less in taxes, boost your returns, facilitate your estate planning, and increase your asset protection. Most members of The White Coat Investor community do these every year, and you should too.
What do you think? Are you doing Backdoor Roth IRAs? Why or why not? Any questions about it?
[This updated post was originally published in 2014.]
White Coat- My wife is 30 and she has decided to stay at home full time with the kids. She has retirement funds through her school and I am going to roll them over to our Fidelity accounts. We currently both contribute 5500 to a traditional IRA then convert to the roth a few days later. Should we do this same thing with her retirement funds with her school when we transfer them to fidelity, or just transfer to a traditional and keep it in there?
You cannot have money in a traditional IRA long-term and do a backdoor Roth IRA. You either need to leave the funds in her 401(k)/403(b), convert them all to a Roth IRA, or not do a backdoor Roth IRA going forward.
My wife has decided to not teach anymore and she has her retirement funds through the school. We are going to roll them over to our IRAs with Fidelity. Every year we do the 5500 roth conversion. Would you recommend doing the same thing when we roll over these funds? She has around 20k that we would be rolling over.
My wife has decided to not teach anymore and she has her retirement funds through the school. We are going to roll them over to our IRAs with Fidelity. Every year we do the 5500 roth conversion. Would you recommend doing the same thing when we roll over these funds? She has around 20k that we would be rolling over.
I understand the Roth conversion. Every year we put 5500 into traditional then convert to Roth a few days later. She has retirement funds through her school that we want to put into ira. What I’m asking is should I do that the same way or convert and leave in traditional ira. Our tax bracket is too high to contribute directly to Roth. Hope this makes sense.
Do you understand that rolling a 401(k) into a traditional IRA will screw up her backdoor Roth IRAs going forward due to the pro-rata issue? If so, what is your plan to deal with it? Here are your choices:
1) Roll it into another 401(k)
2) Convert it all to a Roth IRA
3) Stop doing backdoor Roths for her going forward.
I did not realize this. I did not know you could convert her retirement funds with her school directly to the roth IRA. I am going to convert it to the Roth IRA, then continue doing the roth conversion every year.
I was figuring you couldn’t convert directly to a Roth because we were too high in the tax bracket.
I would try to roll it into a 401(k) instead if possible to avoid the tax hit. But converting is a reasonable option, especially for a small amount.
OK I believe this all makes sense to me. I didn’t realize you could transfer her retirement funds from her school directly into her roth ira since we are too high in tax bracket. I want to continue to do roth conversions for her.
Thanks for all your help. I believe this is what you are saying should be best.
Wait I was trying to do this and you said that I couldn’t use 403b money. How does one directly convert 403b or 401k into Roth IRA if too high a tax bracket?
There is not “too high tax bracket” for Roth conversions. There hasn’t been since 2010.
#2) is possible? I was trying to convert my husband’s 403b into a Roth IRA and I believe you said that it wasn’t possible (so we canceled the transaction)? How do you do option 2? Is a 401K different than 403b?
If I said that, I was mistaken or you misunderstood. You can convert it to a Roth IRA. There is a tax cost for that however, so many will try to avoid that by leaving it in a 401(k)/403(b) or moving it to another 401(k)/403(b). With option 2 you can either do it directly (contact Vanguard or similar and they can send you the form) or you can roll it over into a traditional IRA (again contact Vanguard or similar for the form), then convert the traditional IRA to a Roth IRA.
As I recall, you had a check sent to your house from your 403(b), which is a poor way to do anything with it. If you don’t get that check rolled over within 60 days you can get smacked with significant penalties and taxes as it will be treated as a withdrawal.
Can I convert to a roth multiple times a year. i.e. if I make equal contributions monthly throughout the year, can I convert monthly, or do I have to wait until the end of the year so that I can do the conversion with the whole amount? I would prefer to get the money working as soon as possible, but if I invest the money from January, it could grow thus requiring taxes be paid on the conversion, which I would prefer to avoid.
You could do it monthly, but I wouldn’t. I’d just contribute monthly if you must (preferably all at once) and then convert all at once. So what if it gains 10%? You’ll owe taxes on $500, no biggie. 24 steps to your Backdoor Roth? No thank you. If you have enough income that you have to do a Roth IRA through the backdoor, you have enough income to do it all at once. Just hold your 401(k) contribution that month or something if it seems really tight.
Would a backdoor Roth affect a 401a? My wife has a small amount in an old 401a from a job that she left 9 years ago and honestly forgot that she had. She currently contributes to a traditional IRA, but she did set up a backdoor Roth a few years ago and has moved money from her traditional to her Roth. What affect does a backdoor Roth have on this 401a and what would be some options for moving this small amount in this 401a account without being heavily penalized? She currently works in an office that does not offer retirement options. Thanks for the advice.
Would a backdoor Roth affect a 401A? My wife has a small amount in an old 401a from a job she left 9 years ago and honestly forgot about it. 80% of the amount in this 401a is from interest gained. She currently contributes to a traditional and moves the money into a Roth. Does the backdoor Roth have any tax consequences on the 401a and could she move the amount in the 401a into her Roth? Thank you
No. Separate limits and the 8606 doesn’t ask about a 401(a).
I think she can convert the 401(a) to a Roth IRA, but would have to pay the taxes on it. Other options include just leaving it, and maybe (check on this) rolling it into a 401(k). Those last two wouldn’t have a tax cost obviously.
My wife and I currently file our taxes as “married filing separately” in order to minimize PSLF monthly payments. Are we ineligible to do the backdoor Roth IRA because “married filing separately” disqualifies us? Thanks.
I’m sure you mean IBR, PAYE, or REPAYE payments, not PSLF payments. Whether MFS does any good depends on which of those programs you’re in (for example, with REPAYE MFS doesn’t help.) It would be a relatively unusual situation that you made so much you had to do your Roth IRA contributions through the backdoor yet little enough that MFS makes a significant difference in how much you get forgiven. If you share more of your situation, I might be able to clarify that for you.
But I’ll answer the question you asked, just in case you actually do know what you’re talking about.
There are two steps to a backdoor Roth IRA- the contribution and the conversion. The conversion doesn’t care a bit how you file your taxes. The contribution step, however, has some unique rules summarized well here: https://finance.zacks.com/can-married-filing-separate-contribute-traditional-ira-5384.html
Basically, you can contribute but you must have enough earned income to do so (no spousal IRA). However, under most circumstances (you or your spouse has a plan at work, MAGI > $10K etc) you cannot deduct the contribution. Which is fine if you’re planning to do the backdoor Roth IRA anyway.
I should have clarified:
I am a dentist with a high income and no student loans. My wife is a PGY3 internal medicine resident with student loans. She has been making the minimum payments through IBR for the past 3 years to qualify for PSLF in another 7 years (she is will be staying at a 501(c)(3) hospital). We have been filing our taxes as “married filing separately” in order to minimize her monthly IBR payment (since she is only making a resident salary and I am making a high income) and thus maximize the future amount forgiven.
Can I still make a backdoor Roth IRA contribution for myself? I don’t think she can make a Roth IRA contribution since we are “married filing separately”
Thanks so much for all of your advice. I am an avid reader of your website and it has really helped us with our personal finances!
Yes, you can. And she can do a Roth IRA too, but only through the backdoor. Cool, another good use for the backdoor Roth IRA.
https://www.rothira.com/roth-ira-limits
2 doc family here. wife works part time. joint income around 300k
wife:
rollover ira 2k
sep ira 12k
me:
trad ira 6k
sep ira 17k
i want to do a backdoor roth ira on 1/1/17 but need to do something with this 37k worth of regular ira savings. do you suggest just converting into roth Ira and paying the tax or is it worthwhile to open ANOTHER solo 401k at another institution just to rollover this 37k worth. (already have solo 401k through vanguard but no rollovers allowed like you mentioned)
I’d probably just pay to convert it all. It’ll only be something like $15k in taxes, no? Just consider that an additional contribution to the account.
Through my employer, I have a traditional 401k with matching and a Roth 401k. After maxing out the traditional/match, I can make after-tax contributions to the traditional 401k and I’ve been told I can roll those contributions over using the backdoor into the Roth 401k, which would theoretically allow more than the 5500 max of a Roth IRA. Is this true and/or advisable? Thanks!
You’re talking about a MegaBackdoor Roth IRA. If your plan allows it, then it can be a good option. Is it your best option, I don’t know, not enough info. More details here:
https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/the-mega-backdoor-roth-ira/
Thanks!
Second career medical student here. I currently have about 150k in my old employer’s 401k plan and I am not excited about the investment choices or excessive fees. I was thinking of rolling the money over to my current rollover IRA with about 20k invested but this would generate additional taxes when converting to set up for a backdoor Roth in the future. I guess I could wait until next July and see if my future residency has better 401k investment options (if open to residents), but is there another option I haven’t thought of? I currently have no income.
Yea, convert it all to Roth for free (or very low cost) while in medical school
I estimate I’d be looking at a 30k income tax bill if I converted to a Roth now and don’t have that cash available. Would you suggest I pay the taxes out of the 401k?
No. You should be able to convert a certain amount each year for free. I’d convert that amount, and maybe get into the 10% bracket as well. If it doesn’t look like you’ll be able to convert the whole thing for free/cheap by the end of med school, then I’d probably go to an IRA with that amount with a plan to roll that into a 401(k) eventually.
My husband and I have about $ 100,000 in a brokerage ira at Citibank that we rolled over from our former employers 403b. If we want to do Backdoor Roth IRA, do these accounts have to be zero balance? I plan to open a tradition ira at fidelity then roll over to Roth IRA at fidelity.
Yes. It needs to go into a 401(k) or be all converted to a Roth IRA (and the taxes due paid).
If my husband and I have $100,000 in a brokerage ira at Citibank from a rollover from our former employers’ 403b, do these accounts have to be zero balance before I can do Backdoor Roth IRA? I plan to open tradition and Roth IRA accounts at fidelity. The fidelity rep tells me I do not have to have zero balance. Thanks!
Sorry Fidelity allows their reps to give such bad advice. Now you know why so many will tell you “We can’t give tax advice” because when they do it’s wrong.
I have after tax contributions to a traditional IRA at Vanguard that I’d like to rollover to a Roth. We are not eligible to contribute directly to a Roth IRA due to our income, hence the backdoor. However, when opening a Roth IRA at Vanguard I am required to fund the account. How is that OK if I am not able to contribute directly to a Roth?
Interesting. You should be able to open the account when you do the rollover to it. I guess I never had that issue since I had a pre-2010 Roth IRA when I started doing backdoor Roths.
MP – This is not a problem. You just need to choose the ‘make a deposit myself’ option. That’s not the exact verbiage but that is the gist. I just opened my Roth three months back, and had it sitting at 0 for a couple of weeks with no problem, both for myself and my wife.
Are funds in a 403b and 457b (I have both) safe from the pro rata calculation and not subject to tax when making a back door Roth contribution?
Yes. Only SEP-IRAs, SIMPLE-IRAs, and traditional IRAs. You can see that if you look at line 6 on form 8606.
I have a question, I opened a IRA at vanguard, depositied $5500 and converted it to a Roth IRA, but when I made the conversion, my money market made a dividends of $0.30, so my Roth IRA has $5,500.30. What do I need to do so I get no penalties from the government when I do my taxes?? Any help is appreciated. BTW, I love the website
On your taxes you don’t report pennies. No big deal. Nobody cares. Just include in your rollover for the next year.
Great article. Kudos for continuing to help all of us investors via this long comments section.
I mistakenly contributed $11k earlier this year to my traditional IRA, intending to do backdoor roth conversions for 2015 and 2016. That was before I understood things better. I transferred $5500 to a Roth in 2016, leaving the remaining $5500 in the traditional IRA account. Now I’m stuck trying to get to the $0-balance to avoid the pro-rata rule, seemingly unable to withdraw the $5500 without a penalty, or contribute it to the Roth, which would be an over-contribution for 2015. Do I have any other options?
Not sure what you did wrong. If you put $5500 in there for 2015 and $5500 in there for 2016, why not just move it all to the Roth account instead of just $5,500? If the last $5500 made some money this year, you’ll have to pay tax on that portion of it, but I’d just do that and convert the whole thing before the end of the year.
I think you may be just fine unless I’m missing something.
Thanks for the reply!
In March of 2016, I put $11000 into my IRA, then transferred $5500 to a Roth IRA the same month. Are you saying I could still count that $5500 towards 2015, and transfer a second $5500 and have it count for 2016? And if so, would I then need to go amend my 2015 taxes? My understanding was that the transfers had to happen during the calendar year, but I’d love to be wrong about that.
Thanks for all the great info!
Please let me know if my train of thought is correct:
I’m currently in residency and engaged (wedding in Oct 2017). I’m filing single for 2016. I plan on opening a Roth in Jan 2017 (i’m well under the MAGI for Roth right now) and contributing 5500. When we file our taxes jointly for 2017, I will then have to open a traditional IRA as well (in Jan 2018) and start the backdoor process. Is this correct?
My fiance does not have either a traditional or Roth IRA. She just finished residency and has a salary of 200k. Does she need to open both a traditional and Roth this January if her MAGI is above the limit for a Roth?
The only retirement savings we have right now are our 403s, which I take are not part of the “pro-rate” conversion?
Depends on how much you and your fiancee’ make together. If more than ~$180K or so, then yes, you’ll have to do it via the backdoor. 403bs don’t go on the 8606 so they don’t count in the pro-rata calculation for backdoor Roth IRAs.
Hi,
I am a recently graduated resident who started working as an attending this July. I am an employee.
I do have some cash I’d like to throw into a backdoor Roth IRA, but I just realized that I have a ROLLOVER IRA with Fidelity worth ~$2,688 from an old job from before medical school. I am also employed, and not sure would be able to open a self-employed 401K to “get rid” of the IRA.
What is the best way of dealing with this pesky rollover IRA for the purpose of avoiding pro-rata situation Should I just bite the bullet and convert it to Roth IRA? Everyone keeps telling me I will get a big tax refund next year, since my income from the first half of the year was that of a resident.
Thanks in advance for advice!
Convert it all. Easy choice.
Thanks.
If I do convert the $2,688 Rollover IRA to Roth IRA with Fidelity, would I still be able to open an account with say Vanguard and contribute the full $5,500 for this year for backdoor Roth conversion, or would the $2,688 count toward the $5,500 limit for this year?
Yes, you can still contribute $5,500.
Dear WCI,
I am sorry that I am still so confused. I have a simple IRA for my work. This is managed by LPL. I contribute the max amount each year 12500 and get a match – 3600. I also have vanguard accounts – Roth IRA (from prior) and a SEP IRA with 5100 in it (it was a 403B originally that got converted to a SEP by a FA not sure why). Here are my steps I think I need to do –
1. I know I need to get rid of the SEP and was going to roll it over to Roth IRA and pay the tax.
2. I then plan on opening a tradition IRA at vanguard putting in 5500 and next day roll over the 5500 into my Roth (as back door contribution).
Can I do the SEP roll over $5100 and put in the additional $5500?
Also can I do this if I have a SIMPLE at LPL?
And what happens if I want to manage my SIMPLE on my own eventually – can I no longer do that at Vanguard? Does it have to be at a different company since I cannot have a SIMPLE and do a backdoor roth – or can I just not do this?
Can I also open a separate individual IRA? Contributing post tax dollars with no taxable advantage but another way to save for retirement?
Sorry for all the questions.
The fact that your employer (not you) chose the wrong retirement plan is going to keep you from doing a backdoor Roth IRA very easily. You can do the contributions, but the conversion step isn’t going to work out well due to the pro-rata rule.
So, yes you can CONVERT the SEP IRA to a Roth IRA and you can put an additional $5,500 into a traditional IRA. But the conversion is going to bring in the pro-rata rule due to the SIMPLE.
Ideally you’ll roll over the SIMPLE into an individual 401(k) when you get the chance so you can do backdoor Roths. But just having it at a different company doesn’t solve the pro rata issue.
Contributing non-deductible dollars to a traditional IRA isn’t particularly advantageous if you’re not converting it to a Roth.
So it doesn’t sound like I can do the backdoor Roth without penalties due to the pro-rata issue. Even if I convert the SIMPLE to an individual 401k, I still have to contribute to the SIMPLE since that is how my company has the retirement plan structured. Correct?
In thinking about ways to have tax advantageous retirement plans can I have a SEP and a SIMPLE?
So I actually am part owner now (as of 6 months ago) of a subspecialty group (3 partners). The company is structured so there is a parent company and then each of us have individual S-corps. Parent company pays all the bills, employees, does the billing etc. The SIMPLE is set up by the parent company but I am wondering if I can set up a SEP through my S corp? I am the only employee in my S corp. I would rather do that than having a traditional IRA – since I should have tax advantage for SEP and larger contribution max – would do this through vanguard and manage on my own. Do you know if I can do that? Ultimately I am struggling with where else to place my money since the SIMPLE is so limited (and cannot do backdoor roth). Let’s face it I’ll never retire on my SIMPLE contribution alone!
Money you earn from being an employee can only go into the plans provided by your employer. If you also have self-employed income, you can also do an individual 401(k), or I suppose a SEP-IRA if you really wanted to.
The reason your company probably has a SIMPLE is because you probably have employees and whoever set it up wanted to keep things simpler and less costly than setting up a real 401(k). But just incorporating yourself doesn’t really give you the ability to just use an individual 401(k) instead.
I agree the SIMPLE is inadequate to provide your sole retirement account. I think you ought to do a few things:
# 1 Talk to the other partners and get an analysis done to see if a 401(k)/Profit-sharing plan +/- a Defined Benefit/Cash Balance Plan is right for your practice. If so, switch, roll the SIMPLE into the 401(k), and begin doing backdoor Roths.
# 2 If it isn’t right, then max out the SIMPLE, be sure to max out any options your spouse may have including a spousal backdoor Roth, and then invest in taxable.
Thank you so much for your feedback. We are fully funding my SIMPLE now, my spouses 401K, her HSA, and will be doing backdoor Roth for her. Just does not feel like enough. We have 6+ months in savings and money in other investment accounts (some stocks that we own etc). Will need to invest in taxable accounts for both of us next. Thank you for this site and for your feedback.
I’ve read through all the comment section, but I’m still a little confused.
1) what’s the harm of not converting traditional IRA to Roth IRA. I talked to an accountant who said that I’m at a too high tax bracket and that the conversion is not worth it.
2) I have $16,5K in my traditional IRA. I contributed $5K from 2014 until 2016.
I’m assuming the whole $16,5K would need to be converted where I would pay taxes on that?
Also, I would have to fill out that 8806 form?
Thank you for your time.
You read through the entire comment section? I’m impressed.
1) No harm if the traditional IRA is non-deductible. If it is deductible (i.e. pre-tax money) then you have to pay taxes to convert it. You’re confusing the backdoor Roth IRA (where the alternatives are a much inferior taxable account and non-deductible traditional IRA) with a simple Roth conversion of pre-tax money (where the alternative is a not necessarily inferior pre-tax traditional IRA.
2) If you are doing Roth conversions, then yes, you’ll need to do an 8606. Whether you would owe taxes on that $16.5K depends on whether you got a deduction when you contributed it. If so, then yes, you’ll owe taxes. If not, then you owe taxes only on the gains.
Thanks for your timely reply. From what I understand, the accountant was saying to not convert my Traditional IRA to Roth IRA, i.e. not do a backdoor IRA as I would pay too many taxes after the conversion. He’s recommending to leave my money in the traditional IRA and not convert anything. ??
What I’m saying is that a Backdoor Roth is different than a Roth conversion. The Backdoor Roth IRA has no tax cost. A Roth conversion does. Sometimes you have to do a Roth conversion to facilitate the backdoor Roth, but the backdoor Roth itself is tax-free.
So yeah, I started reading through the comments and became really bogged down with additional details so I apologize if it was answered previously. I currently contribute to a ROTH IRA, do not have any other retirement accounts (my job does not offer a match on 401K or any other retirement accounts, so I decided to max my ROTH instead as I cannot afford to do much more than that). I am in my last year of residency and I will be over the income limits for the year Jan 2017 – Dec 2017 once I start private practice (combining my resident salary with half of my new salary post-residency)…filing single.
I thought that the max contributions were for a given calendar year (Jan-Dec) not a given tax year (Apr-Apr), so I have maxed out my ROTH for tax year 2016-2017 with this months’ payment. Because my income will be over the limit for calendar year 2017, should I start contributing to a traditional IRA with my post-tax money up to the limit starting tax year 2017 (April 2017) and convert to my current ROTH IRA once I have reached the max contribution for the tax year to avoid any penalties? For instance, if I start contributing to my ROTH IRA after April 2017 while in residency and start making quadruple my salary in July 2017, will I be penalized? Just trying to make sure I go about this the right way.
I was also told by the practice that I may be joining that I will not be able to participate in the 401K until after I have been with them for a year. Given that, it seems best to just pay down my student loans with the extra money in the meantime. What do you think?
Please correct me if you notice any discrepancies. Trying to learn this on my own as I go. Thanks!
You contribute for the tax year, Jan 16 to Dec 16 or Jan 17 to Dec 17 even though you can do so until April of the next year.
As far as what to do next year, I would focus on paying down your loans, maybe saving up a down payment, and make sure you get your $5,500 into a Roth IRA via the backdoor. I’d just do it all at once at some point in the Fall or Winter rather than dribbling into an IRA all year.
I transferred about $40000 from my roll-over IRA (from a previous tax deferred retirement account) to my employer’s 401k plan in March 2016. That left me with about $5000 of after-tax money in an IRA from a IRA contribution in 2014. I made that contribution back then before I realized I should be using the backdoor Roth IRA instead.
I’m probably over-reading this b/c I think you are saying that so long as the value in traditional IRA accounts is zero on December 31st I wouldn’t be subject to the conversion tax on the entire $45000 but only $5000 and I think the value would be zero if I converted the traditional IRA to a Roth IRA. However, I’m still unsure whether I can convert that remaining $5000 in the traditional IRA to Roth via the backdoor now or whether I need to wait until 2017 to avoid the conversion tax on the entire $45000. Sorry if you already addressed this question above.
No. Do it this week. Then your balance on Dec 31st is zero. If that $5K is all after-tax money, then there should be no tax bill for converting it, even though you did a $40K rollover the week before.
thanks. got the form completed to convert to a Roth IRA. This should give me one additional year of doing back door Roth conversions!
I am a new attending (finished residency in July), and started my private practice and also do some 1099 on the side. For the past few years, I have been contributing to a SEP-IRA account (Vanguard) through my business (1099 moonlighting income), and I rolled over my employee 401K (my residency) to this SEP-IRA account. I currently have around $23K in my SEP-IRA. My wife also has about $24K in a Rollover IRA (Vanguard) from her previous employee. She is no longer employed and not currently working. I am not certain how to proceed with a backdoor Roth IRA. Do you recommend that I covert my SEP-IRA to my Roth-IRA account? Should my wife do the same? I believe that we are probably in our lowest tax bracket this year since I earned residency salary for half of the year (Jan-July). Do I need to open a traditional IRA account for my backdoor Roth-IRA. Also I am wondering what type of account I should use (Traditional 401K?) for making pre-tax contributions through my business. Thank you for your advice.
Open an individual 401(k) for your 1099 income. Roll your SEP-IRA money in there or into your private practice 401(k) if there is one. Either get your wife $10 of self-employment income (online surveys or babysitting would work) and open an individual 401(k) for her. Roll her rollover IRA in there. The start doing backdoor Roth IRAs for each of you. Alternatively, you can pay the taxes on your SEP-IRA and/or her Rollover IRA and just convert the whole things. That’s usually a great move in the year you finish residency if you can figure out a way to afford the taxes.
Yes, you’ll need both a traditional IRA and a Roth IRA to do the backdoor Roth IRA.
Thank you. I decided to covert both my wife’s and my own IRAs to our Roth IRA accounts. It looks like we don’t have enough time to do a backdoor Roth. I just got off the phone with Vanguard and they told me that there is not enough time to contribute to a traditional IRA and convert it to Roth before Dec 31. Now that we don’t have SEP and Rollover IRAs, I am hoping that it will be easier for us to do backdoor Roth next year. I am planning to open an individual 401k for my practice (pretax contributions), and a traditional IRA to use for backdoor Roth.
My wife has been helping me with my private practice. Do you recommend that I put her on pay roll (W2 vs. 1099), so she can contribute to Roth or other types of accounts? I believe that she needs to have an income in order to do backdoor Roth? Correct?
Thank you again.
You can do the conversion step any time. The contribution has to be done by April 15th. So you have plenty of time. Your 8606 will just be more complicated.
It can make sense to hire a spouse to get more retirement space, but bear in mind you’ll also have to pay SS tax on that income.
Generally speaking a non-working spouse (no earnings) can indeed contribute to IRA (Roth, Traditional or “backdoor”) based on the working spouse’s earnings.
I agree. However I was thinking about 401(k)s.
If my employer offers no retirement benefits (401K/403b), does it make sense to do a Backdoor IRA or should I just leave it as a traditional IRA and deduct it from taxes in April? I’m single without any children, don’t own a business (I’m a W2 employee), and don’t own a home.
Great question. In your case, you’re weighing Roth vs traditional, which is far more complicated than Roth vs taxable. This post may help:
https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/should-you-make-roth-or-traditional-401k-contributions/
It deals more with 401(k)s, but the issues are the same.
My wife and I have opened traditional IRA (myself and spousal) with Fidelity and Vangaurd. We then converted each to Roth for backdoor Roth IRA. In subsequent years, how do we convert traditional IRA to ROTH each year? So I have a traditional IRA with a zero balance now and the roth has the 5500 I converted. For 2017, can I fund the zero balance traditional IRA and then rollover into the existing ROTH (Is rollover different than conversion?) I guess my question is, how do I fund the roth fromn a traditional IRA in years other than the initial conversion year? Can I convert into the existing Roth for 2017? If not, it seems I would have to open a new roth every year.
I am a new attending. My wife and I have traditional IRA s(myself and spousal) with Vangaurd . I opened mine in March 2016 and my wife in August 2016 . I had a prior 403 B from my training program in a traditional IRA which had both after tax and pre tax contributions in it in August 2016. I have moved over my pre tax contributions to an individual 401K in august 2016. The amount left in my traditional IRA is only 5500 ( post tax) only). My wife had converted her IRA to Roth for backdoor Roth IRA immediately. I am afraid I waited too long to convert to Roth for backdoor Roth IRA and I just did it on December 31st 2016. Vanguard is informing me that the transfer will not happen until Jan 3rd 2017 as it is a holiday weekend. So on Dec 31st my traditional IRA still is not zero. T Please advice how I should account for this on my 2016 tax filing?
Well, your procrastination has simply made your paperwork more confusing, that’s all. Nothing terrible though. Basically, you did the contribution in 2016 and the conversion in 2017. This post is for you:
https://www.whitecoatinvestor.com/late-contributions-to-the-backdoor-roth-ira/