Thrifty. Frugal. Cheap. Similar meanings with different connotations. One, a lost virtue. Another, an insult. I find that I tend to swing rapidly between being ultra-frugal and being a spendthrift (although my wife would say I spend far more time on the left side of that pendulum). I like to think of it as spending my money on those things I value most, but deep down I know there isn't always that much logic behind what I decide to blow my cash on. Some days I just feel more frugal than others I guess.
Doctors Can Buy Anything They Want, Right?
Since I started making the “big bucks“, I've noticed a strange and somewhat disturbing trend. I feel much more obligated to spend around family, friends, and even acquaintances. It might be the obligation I feel to pick up the bill at a restaurant, to spend more on gifts, to chip in more money when meals are ordered into work, or to simply have nicer stuff. “I should have nicer clothes, I'm a doctor.” “I should drive a better car, I'm a doctor.” These aren't necessarily always things I care much about (although occasionally they are), but it seems there is a bit of societal expectation weighing on all of us. I think, on some subconscious level, it works about like this:
Doctors are rich and can buy anything they want. I am a doctor. Therefore I can buy anything I want. Because I can buy anything I want, I should. Or, since I make more than the person I am with, I should pay.
Finding a Balance Between Frugality and Spending
It's very strange. It's not entirely logical (although not entirely illogical). And it is often very uncomfortable, and not necessarily because I particularly mind spending the money. I confess I have a difficult time finding balance with the issue. You want to use your earning ability to provide a comfortable life for yourself and your family. You want to help others. You want to be generous with the fruits of years of hard work, good luck, and outright blessings. But you don't want to be taken advantage of, nor have others feel entitled or expectant of your largesse. And you certainly don't want to be wasteful, no matter how little money is involved.
In some ways, it is a lot like being at work. You don't mind doing some charity care. You really did go into medicine to help others. But it really turns you off to have people describe Medicaid as “insurance” and to come in by ambulance for a sandwich. I don't think the solution is simply to hang out just with high-earners so you feel more comfortable socioeconomically, but I would just as soon hide the fact that I am a physician from people I meet socially until I know them a little better.
Friends and family don't usually help with this. They're proud of us, and want to show us off or even offer a little praise by introducing us as, “my son, the doctor” or “this is my friend, the rich doctor.” I suppose I feel the same way about them, and do similar things when I introduce them to others. “This is my sister, the CEO” for example. I guess I just prefer that expectations for me be set a little lower.
Staying Down to Earth
I enjoy the relative anonymity of going down to the local disc golf course for an hour or two before or after a shift. Disc golf is the ultimate cheapo sport since you can get started for less than $10 and you can pretty much buy any equipment your heart desires for $200.
I might play a pick-up round with a plumber, a convenience store clerk, and a homeless guy who puts his tent up in the park every night after everyone goes home. We might bet $5 on the game. I'm glad they have no idea how long it takes me to make that $5 at work. No expectations. Just throwing plastic through the trees and hoping you don't toss your favorite disc in the creek. The only personal question anyone ever asks is, “Anybody here a cop?” just before they light up their bowl of wacky tobacky on the back nine.
Comments? How do you cope with the societal expectation that doctors spend more (whether or not they actually make more?) Did you start acting differently at some point after residency? How do you stay “down-to-earth?” Or do you even try?
I’ve had the same experiences of being uncomfortable with people knowing that I’m a physician. There’s the financial portion which you explained well, and then there’s the part where people will sometimes start describing their medical problems to you and ask you to critique the treatment that their current physician is giving them.
Most of the time people are asking you what you do because they have their own story about what they do and are ready to talk about it. So I just say something to the effect of “I work at the base in town. It’s a tough job, and I’m happy to get a break today so that I can be outside and enjoy this great weather. You look like a hard worker too – what do you do?”
Shortly after residency, my wife and I bought a large house, later we bought a large piece of land and moved to a log home. We certainly don’t try to hang out with people who make a lot; other than my partners, our friends are of pretty average income; teachers, insurance agent, car salesman, etc.
We sometimes pick up the meal tab, but only because it’s fun. And we often do it for the nephews and nieces (or friends of our kids) who stay with us. But we don’t feel an obligation to appear well-to-do.
Fortunately, having four children has rendered us much less well-to-do, and the vagaries of the market have ravaged our retirement. So, not much danger of lavish retirements etc. Might as well enjoy what we have while we have it. With inflation and government confiscation, I figure I won’t end up with much anyway.
You really make it seem so easy with your presentation but I find this matter to be actually something which I think I would never understand. It seems too complex and extremely broad for me. I’m looking forward for your next post, I’ll try to get the hang of it!
I have taken several european tours with groups and was reluctant to divulge my profession as I didn’t want late night calls about diarrhea, etc. I told the truth about my education, just left off the part about medical school and residency. I was amazed at the lengths some strangers will go to get info-every night at dinner it always came back to what I did with my time (I volunteer!) and how I could afford an expensive trip. I am not sure why they found it so curious. At home I always treat my siblings and their kids to dinner when we go out, but they don’t expect it. I live modestly. Appreciate your blog!!
I completely agreement with your assessment about societal expectations. As a recent graduate, the perception is that you’re rolling in money, your fees are too high and the lifestyle is enviable but the debt burden is never factored in. I try to educate many friends who assume that I am comfortable by explaining the sacrifices, time and debt required to undergo any sort of medical or professional education. Some understand or at least are open to listening, others have preconceived notions so you’re not gonna get any traction.
this is a huge problem for me on almost a monthly basis and i’m just a lowly dentist.
I get comments sometimes on “why don’t i have a smartphone, aren’t i a doctor?”
My wife constantly complains that we don’t live in a house befitting of our income level… and certainly i am probably “under-housed” by even the most conservative principles… I am fine with my home.. it fits all my needs and is in a very decent area.
I have friends that don’t ever say anything negative towards me, but always ask how business is… and by the slant of their questions i can only assume they think things really haven’t ever gone well for me because i don’t show any signs of wealth… average car, average house, below average clothes, etc.
In fact, if i hadn’t gone on a few exotic trips of late they would probably assume i was a near failure making like 50k a year or something.
sometimes i just want to publish my net worth statement with the magazines i put on my coffee table so that if people want to know where the money goes.. it’s in there!
I have one friend that’s given me some marketing ideas because of his assumption i’m not doing well.
I’ve told him… “listen, if you 5X’d my income you’d barely notice a difference in the way i live.. I don’t want to live large, my goal is not to work at all!”
But no one gets that… it’s a hard sell in life to fade the public who grade you only by your possessions and luxuries.
The bit about the smartphone cracks me up. We got our first cell phone upon med school graduation in 03. Bought a second one upon residency graduation in 06. Got our first smart phone last summer. The second one for Christmas- over 5 years out of residency. They’re wonderful, but we just felt like we had other spending priorities until then.
I can’t believe how many Medicaid/Self-pay patients I see in the ED with iphones.
Long ago my father told me never to tell anyone I was a doctor, because I would be overcharged. I do not advertise that I am a physician, I don’t like people working in or around my home to know I am a physician, and in some cases I flat out lie about my profession–as long as I do not anticipate a prolonged conversation that would out me.
I too have perceived an obligation to pay for meals with friends who earn significantly less, or to put in more than my share when splitting meals with those whose budgets are tighter. On the other hand, I’ve had relatives who I know earn less than I do insist on paying for me, as a guest in town and/or younger relative, which also makes me a little uncomfortable, so my paying for less fortunate friends is just “paying it forward.”
When I purchased a “luxury” car years ago, the display of wealth actually made me uncomfortable, but I bought it because that class of car offered the option of a loaner delivered to my home/ worksite when my car went in for service/repair. Given the hours and extra weekends I was working, I could not see myself giving up one of my few free days to get my car worked on. I love the car, I will drive it until it dies or no longer makes financial sense to fix it, but I don’t think I will buy the same make again, because the maintenance is correspondingly more expensive.
@shadowreader – i do the same thing… i never tell people what i do if I can avoid it.
When i was young and single but had started working, when i was out a the bars with friends i’d often tell ladies that i was “still in school” or “working in health care industry ” or something because i didn’t want them to stick around in the conversation if it was just going to be because i was a DDS.
I have a general disdain for showing wealth.. I’ll never do the luxury car thing. One day i suppose i’ll upgrade to a “doctor grade” home and people will finally realize things are going ok for me. And then when i retire early and enjoying life (knock on wood that the stock market does that i need it to do to make that actually happen.. and that i don’t die of something first) people will probably realize i was sneaky wealthy.. that’s fine.
I don’t mind paying for things for long-term friends who are less fortunate… i agree that’s just being cool and paying it forward… plus they are all patients and spend a little money with me anyway.
I think Biggie Smalls summarized it best: “mo money, mo problems”
dont belive the hype. unless you are in solo practice, get paid cash by patients,bypassing insurance cos, you are dependent on corporations or the govt for your salary. they determine how much you are paid. they will continue to cut your money and attach strings.
u start later than most pros in earning, pay a lot of tax, and probably have to fend for yourself in retirement. plus there are potentian liabilities, more the more you work.
i have been doing thei for 30 years and preparing to go part/time/retire.
u still have to pay bills, nobody cares that you are an md– they still want money.
am not trying to pain a dark pic, just same reality for you as for everybody.
live frugal, thats the solution– and xxx th hype.
There is an enormous amount of time and energy devoted to doctors in a book. How some are living large and have little net worth, and others are living modestly and have a huge net worth. I believe they use fictitious names Dr. North and Dr. South. “The millionaire next door”, by Stanley and Danko.
You can purchase it here
http://www.amazon.com/b?_encoding=UTF8&camp=1789&creative=9325&linkCode=ur2&node=1000&site-redirect=&tag=whicoainv-20
This is obviously an old post, but I had an experience about a year ago that is apropos. About a year after residency I was getting into my grandfatherly ’06 Buick Regal (bought at auction in med school) after working out at the gym. Several college age kids were standing behind the late model sports car beside me. One girl said, “Aren’t you a doctor? Then why are you driving THIS?” After I explained that living like this had allowed me to recently retire my student debt, a boy mentioned that he had $60k in student debt, had quit taking classes, and had no idea how he was going to pay it. I guess selling the sports car wasn’t an option? Perhaps I should have offered to exchange cars with him…
Hmmmm…..that Regal is newer than both my cars. 🙂
Correction: it is a ’96 Regal, not ’06! Paid $3500 in med school in 2006 and drove it until summer of ’14. It would take awhile to get that annualized cost on a new car….
You’ve got me beat with the ’96. I haven’t had something that old for quite a while.
Yes, indeed.
We had a 95 Volvo 960 4 door sedan bought new when I finished residency. I had also moonlighted like a dog prior to that to pay back student loans, bills, and etc. So we thought we should AT LEAST get something “STATELY”. We drove that thing until 2013 at around 200K miles before I sold it. That thing was always flaky when new and since I was very mechanically inclined (took shop in high school and fixed everything that was mechanical around the house while a teenager), I was ON IT as far as the new car warranty was concerned. Constantly took it to the dealer for ANY AND ALL WARRANTY ISSUES, BIG AND SMALL. And pretty much got all the bugs worked out BEFORE the warranty expired. Thank God, no more issues afterwards. Just the usual maintenance stuff which was more expensive than the Japanese car counterparts. But back then, the reliable Japanese cars DID NOT drive as well nor were they as safe (now they are very close). I did the usual maintenance stuff myself personally. One day my neighbor asked me why I work on my car myself. He said : “You are a doctor. You should NOT be working on your own car!!”. To which I said, if you REALLY knew who changes your oil at the dealership or some of the shops, you would not go there. Meaning the lowest paid and the least experienced person doing the work at most shops.
So we drove that Volvo until the paint was fading, but still reliable bc I knew essentially every components of that car and kept it in top shape. Nosy neighbors and friends sometimes asked us when and if we were going to get a new car. Finally, as our kids grew older and we had to take them to sports practices some distance away with all that gear and stuff, we gave in and sold it.
We came to the conclusion why should we be apologitic about which car to own or drive (just because I’m a “doctor”)? I think if one is frugal and plan ahead, then all good. So we decided to get an SUV and settled on the Lexus LX470 (no longer in production. Now is the LX570). Before anybody says anything……. I negotiated the best deal I could and got $21K OFF the MRSP brand new at the time at year end). Drove that thing to some trouble free 280K+ miles before selling it.
As one other poster had mentioned regarding the fact that we work long hours and do not want to spend unnecessary time dealing with vehicle problems……..we found that Lexus to be one of the most reliable vehicles out there (especially the LX or the Toyota Land Cruiser counterpart SUV’s. That’s why United Nations buys and uses primarily Toyota Land Cruiser overseas). Guaranteed a loaner anytime our Lexus is in the Lexus dealership for ANYTHING. Always treated like royalty and etc. If we do not have the time to take it to the Lexus dealership, they have a flatbed truck to come to me to pick up and deliver back to me when done (free of charge).
By comparison………my buddy and his wife during the same time period as we had that one LX470, they went through two brand new GMC Yukons XL, two brand new MB GL’s, and one brand new Jeep Grand Cherokee. All had troubles after trouble. I’m sure my buddy and his wife spent far more on vehicles then our one LX470 during the same time period.
Anyway, my point is we should NOT be apologitic about which car to own or drive or anything at all (just because I’m a “doctor”)? I think if one is frugal and plan ahead and still live within our means, then all good.
Pretty strange post overall. I don’t understand the undercover/deception/identity crisis of being who you are. An occupation is just one facet of your being. The bigger issue may be the desire to escape by gambling and hanging with drugs. 🙁
I don’t feel the “societal expectation”. Perhaps it is because of the environment we chose to live, but it is not an issue. We have professional friends mostly but spend our time at parks with kids or hiking in the woods and down rivers. My wife and I have had the same wardrobe for 15 years and our car has a permanent license (old) with cracked windshield. We live without electricity and water some days.
This one was a swing-and-miss for me.
I don’t like anyone knowing my profession coz….Most of the pple think that..to be a doctor means you can afford this or that……etc…This title is so manipulative….i would never let anyone know my proffesion…feels nice to be like everybody.
This must be one of the earlier posts 🙂 but still so relevant. Frankly, being thrifty/frugal is how we got to current net worth, as I knew zilch about investing (and still know minimally now). Also, the longer we have been thrifty and the higher our net worth grows, the more I don’t miss with my thrifty lifestyle. Don’t get me wrong, we have definitely loosen the purse-strings, we give more to causes we believe in. My kids do get a new book (via a book order at school or on Amazon) if it is something I know they will read/cherish for a while. Otherwise, I still clip coupons at the grocery store. I look at the ads weekly and plan my bulk shopping trips (half-priced chicken – sign me up for that!). We do our yard work, housekeeping and laundry, and we are teaching our older kids to clean the bathrooms now.
Oh, and I don’t have that much of a problem with societal expectations of me nearly as much- most people assume I’m a nurse/tech when I tell them I work at the hospital or even if I introduced myself as a doctor (in a professional setting). Minority, female, small-built, young-ish looking.
For a female Dr, it is very often a case of ” what does you husband do ? ” very funny , especially when it is in the dog park patting pooches…totally out of the blue . God bless them, they have to know what he does 🙂
One of my friends once said something like ” you must be raking it in ” I said ” You would be too, if you were working 80 hours a week like I do ”
I don’t hide who I am, it is a big part of my identity , and I leave other people to sort out their own assumptions .
Great blog, really enjoying it- thank you.
I love the “you would be too if you were working 80 hours a week.” I’ll have to start using that.
I love most of the posts here. This is easy, folks Always be frugal. If you want to splurge, do it for someone or a cause that is needy. People don’t mind if you are modest; there is no obligation to flaunt your wealth. I am a multi millionaire many times over, but I drive a 11 year-old car with 188,000 miles on it because it works, I like it, and it has been garaged kept and still looks good. I could care less what people think about that. But I couldn’t care more about how my patients do. Plus, my kids have picked up on my frugality and it has really helped them stay out of trouble with things like credit card and student loan debt. Everything we have has been given to us. Let’s use as much of it as we can to help others.