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**jhwkr542** · 06-12-2019, 02:35 AM

Some look high, but some you won't be able to change I bet. The property taxes are usually based on home value, so nothing you can do there (though it looks like an expensive home). The title insurance looks high as well as the application and maybe appraisal fees. This is part of shopping for a mortgage people tend to ignore but can make a difference.

**orthodoc2018** · 06-12-2019, 02:39 AM

Thanks - home to me doesn't seem very expensive at all - $440k but it's in the northeast where property taxes are killer.

I'll look around a little and see what others are offering. Not sure anyone will really be able to match it so closely at 0% down though. I'll have to do some good old arithmetic and see if a slightly higher rate is worth some lower fees.

**jfoxcpacfp** · 06-12-2019, 02:40 AM

Interesting - we've had a wave of clients wanting us to analyze closing costs to refi in the last couple of weeks. As a result, I've seen several of these lately. This list seems to have more annoying extra costs than usual, but I don't think many of them have anything to do with the specific bank other than application fee, appraisal fee, and tax service fee (any bankers out there, please correct me if I'm wrong). What it looks like is that there are a lot of local/state regulations piling on at a cost to borrowers, such as Tax Stamp for County Mortgage of $4,400 - that sounds outrageous to me. I suppose the Aggregate Adjustment of ($2,561.81) is supposed to mitigate part of these costs. You're still paying ~$7,500 to get this done, right?

Nothing you can do about the prepaid tax and insurance, you're just banking that. And they've got to prorate interest, too, of course.

What are you going from to get 3.75%? That still sounds high to me. Have you shopped around?

**CordMcNally** · 06-12-2019, 02:40 AM

They're all outrageous but I doubt any of them are negotiable. Unfortunately, fees are customary for any closing.

**orthodoc2018** · 06-12-2019, 02:45 AM

jfoxcpacfp wrote:

Interesting – we’ve had a wave of clients wanting us to analyze closing costs to refi in the last couple of weeks. As a result, I’ve seen several of these lately. This list seems to have more annoying extra costs than usual, but I don’t think many of them have anything to do with the specific bank other than application fee, appraisal fee, and tax service fee (any bankers out there, please correct me if I’m wrong). What it looks like is that there are a lot of local/state regulations piling on at a cost to borrowers, such as Tax Stamp for County Mortgage of $4,400 – that sounds outrageous to me. I suppose the Aggregate Adjustment of ($2,561.81) is supposed to mitigate part of these costs. You’re still paying ~$7,500 to get this done, right?

Nothing you can do about the prepaid tax and insurance, you’re just banking that. And they’ve got to prorate interest, too, of course.

What are you going from to get 3.75%? That still sounds high to me. Have you shopped around?

Click to expand...

Yeah lots of local/state fees - welcome to NY!

Everyone else I have inquired with is offering rates of ~4% and most want 5% down. I could definitely get it lower with an ARM or 15-year mortgage. Hadn't really considered it that strongly but maybe I should...

**DerekLava** · 06-12-2019, 02:47 AM

Mind if I ask which lender is offering the 30yr, 3.75% with $0 down? Starting to gather information for next year.

**orthodoc2018** · 06-12-2019, 02:48 AM

DerekLava wrote:

Mind if I ask which lender is offering the 30yr, 3.75% with $0 down? Starting to gather information for next year.

Click to expand...

Sure - KeyBank.

That's with "relationship pricing" so you'll need a checking and savings account with them. I was able to find a checking with no monthly fee and a savings account that just requires a $300 balance to waive the fee.

**ENT Doc** · 06-12-2019, 06:41 AM

Some of those fees do look absurd. Shop around the title companies and you might find a little bit of difference. Real estate is like coming out of the swamp in ‘nam. Covered in leeches.

**orthodoc2018** · 06-12-2019, 07:01 AM

Absurd is why I would use to describe it when I saw it!

So the title is something I obtain independent of the mortgage lender?

Just looked briefly and many places seem to suggest that title insurance rates are regulated and fixed in NY. Anyone know anything about that? Same thing applies to the mortgage tax apparently. In any event, it makes me happy I’m not buying more house!

**ENT Doc** · 06-12-2019, 07:41 PM

orthodoc2018 wrote:

Absurd is why I would use to describe it when I saw it!

So the title is something I obtain independent of the mortgage lender?

Just looked briefly and many places seem to suggest that title insurance rates are regulated and fixed in NY. Anyone know anything about that? Same thing applies to the mortgage tax apparently. In any event, it makes me happy I’m not buying more house!

Click to expand...

Keep in mind these numbers came from a lender. They always cast a worst case scenario and are not the title company nor are they the purchase contract. In some areas the seller pays the title insurance/fees, not the buyer. You need to look at your purchase contract and know your regional practice to know that. But let's say for the sake of argument that you, the buyer, are paying for the title insurance.

Call around to title companies. The insurance part itself is indeed fixed - you probably won't find much variation on that at all. The fees, however, you might find a few hundred dollar swing in one direction or another. Since there are lots of title companies and the prices are typically close to one another the only way to really compete for business is on quality - do they have an in-house attorney who would review trust documents for free, do they have a notary who could come to your work on closing for free so you don't have to miss work. Ask about anything and everything that would make your situation as convenient as possible. If one is more costly than another, tell the costlier one who might have better services outright - your buddy down the road is quoting me X and you are quoting me Y, can you give me a discount to their price if I go with you?

YOU pick the title company if you're paying for title. Yes, the tax is probably a transfer tax - another complete BS charge that has zero things to do with capital gains on the property or not. Just another fixed cost to account for in this leech infested swamp you now find yourself in.

**udrag14** · 06-12-2019, 08:30 PM

I just closed a house in NY with KeyBank, previously Laurel Road. My numbers are very similar to yours.

I also dont know where you are in the process but I was quoted around 5 to 6K more fees and then it dropped near closing when a lot of them were assigned to the seller. it seems like the systen assigns thr buyer all the costs and then your lawyer will seperate then.

In general, most of the charges are standard. Most of the cost is actually in the escrow. They require a lot more cushion compared to other lenders.

If you go with Keybank, make sure you are a AMA member. You get additional 1000 dollars off for a 60 dollar membership.

**Tim** · 06-12-2019, 09:35 PM

Try this:
https://www.realdirect.com/closing_calculator/

**justlearning** · 06-12-2019, 09:46 PM

we used Costco for mortgage and application fee was waived from the lender and rates were competitive as well. I think we saved around $1300 from the fees etc. You may want to check it out.

https://costcofinance.com/

**Hatton** · 06-12-2019, 09:57 PM

Who knew Costco does a mortgage too.

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